Spanish police blocking 2 drones near king Felipe VI

[nobsyogi]

I was flying at Cannes port & the police told me to bring my Mini 3 down ASAP.
They then escorted me to a nearby police van & interrogated me. They told me I was flying in a no fly zone. I told them that according to the DJI app I was outside the red zone, hence, I was able to fly with caution. They then asked for my registration (I had done my French Aviation Authority drone pilot testing & registration only a month earlier). As I was on a Mediterranean cruise they contacted the cruise ship to confirm my identity along with my Australian drivers license on my iPhone.
They’d never seen a Mini 3 & were very intrigued. They had a device similar to a EFTPOS machine with maybe 30-40 different drone apps etc. Somehow I think the device is linked to the FAA as I had to enter in all my registration details. They then received a phone call from someone confirming my FAA registration. They then asked to see my video footage. I told them I can’t replay it without pulling the SD card out of the drone (luckily I had the battery that says 249g on it in the drone).
They told me they are going to look at the video to see if I’ve broken any other drone laws.
After looking at my videos of Cannes & St. Paul-de-Vence they then commented on how proficient my flying & videos were. They said you’re very experienced with well over 200 flights are you a professional. I told them I’m only a hobby flier.
They then started up my Pro RC & drone & checked DJI’s warnings etc. & told me they are wrong, it should be a no fly zone. They told me as I’ve broken no other laws they’ll let me go, but, in future to use the Géoportail app to find out exactly where I can fly in France. They will also report that the DJI app is inaccurate for go fly zones.
All up I was detained for about 45 minutes. Initially when I was detained & told them I’m on a cruise ship, they did ask me what time my cruise ship was leaving & that made me real anxious!

 

[Aerophile]

Glad the gendarmes let you go and didn't send you off to Devils Island.

I would never rely on DJI (or any other company) to keep me flying legally. DJI and other companies have other things that are more important (to them) to keep track of, rather than detailing every single airspace restriction in the world for users. Info supplied by DJI might be useful as a supplement to official government sources, but the official stuff is what counts (I could write an app that says you are free to fly wherever you wanted, and I'd only charge $1 per download, would you rely on that to stay out of jail?...hmmm, I bet such an app would be popular...hey, maybe my early retirement plan?)

DJI is very far away and isn't going to bail you out of the Bastille. It's each pilot's responsibility to know where they are about to fly, and if there are restrictions there. Yes, it can be an inconvenience.

 

[Harryscopic]

Some fylers are just ignorant, but others know that the're cheating. Like some people steal and they think it's just fine as long as they're not caught. The laws and regulations are for safety reasons, and though it's true they are not well adjusted to society's real needs yet, they must be respected. In time they will be corrected.

 

[Robert Prior]

I would never rely on DJI (or any other company) to keep me flying legally.

I've compared the DJI flight restrictions to the Transport Canada ones, and they are both too restrictive (preventing you flying where it's legal) and not restrictive enough (not even warning you when you are inside the radius of an airport).

 

[Red_Pyro]

Some fylers are just ignorant, but others know that the're cheating. Like some people steal and they think it's just fine as long as they're not caught. The laws and regulations are for safety reasons, and though it's true they are not well adjusted to society's real needs yet, they must be respected. In time they will be corrected.

The entire red zone west from France has been there for at least 2 years (first time I discovered it). Do you really believe they would willingly go back to less restrictions ?

 

[Red_Pyro]

While announcing your intention to violate the local laws while you're a guest, do you really find it necessary to insult the government agencies of the countries you plan to visit?

Yes I just did. It's a long strech between stealing in another country and flying on the outskirts of a village that's painted all red from some software.

 

[Aerophile]

The entire red zone west from France has been there for at least 2 years (first time I discovered it). Do you really believe they would willingly go back to less restrictions ?

He never said they would "go back to less restrictions" (although I guess that is a possibility, it seems unlikely to me).

He said "In time they will be corrected."

In fact, they could easily be "corrected" to become more restrictive and the punishments for violating them more harsh. Depends on your view of what's "correct."

That's how authorities generally react when they set some regulation, and it becomes clear that lots of people just ignore the regulations. Their typical response to that is to increase the penalties, and/or add even greater restrictions. Giving the middle finger to agencies that regulate behavior is generally not a good strategy to win them over to your side.

The local police let nobsyogi go after about 45 minutes of polite discussion. If enough people ignore the airspace rules, next time this happens the visitor might watch his cruise ship sail off from the window of a jail.

Not saying this is good, just saying, human behavior and the way of authorities is what it is...

 

[Red_Pyro]

He never said they would "go back to less restrictions" (although I guess that is a possibility, it seems unlikely to me).

He said "In time they will be corrected."

In fact, they could easily be "corrected" to become more restrictive and the punishments for violating them more harsh. Depends on your view of what's "correct."

That's how authorities generally react when they set some regulation, and it becomes clear that lots of people just ignore the regulations. Their typical response to that is to increase the penalties, and/or add even greater restrictions. Giving the middle finger to agencies that regulate behavior is generally not a good strategy to win them over to your side.

The local police let nobsyogi go after about 45 minutes of polite discussion. If enough people ignore the airspace rules, next time this happens the visitor might watch his cruise ship sail off from the window of a jail.

Not saying this is good, just saying, human behavior and the way of authorities is what it is...

That's most definitely what's going to happen, a few more minor accidents until only the police themselves will be able to fly.

 

[MS Coast]

Yes I just did.

I can disagree with someone without denigrating them. You apparently see the world differently.

It's a long strech between stealing in another country and flying on the outskirts of a village that's painted all red from some software.

I have no idea what this is about? Was there any discussion of theft?

 

[JoshC]

Be mindful of Aeroscope, for example the two pilots caught on this thread were caught by Aeroscope, and I'll bet that in France is plenty of them too.

Expect Aeroscope near major airports or important events, it's range is about 5Km for the portable units and 50 for the big antennas. Areoscope it's just a listener, so if you have the FCC mod it can be more. The best way to counter Aeroscope is by turning off GPS in the phone and walk away from the homepoint. You can also move the homepoint to a near location after take off.

The classic shoot&move strategy of a marksman works well here.

Homepoint is where the police will go, but if GPS on the smartphone is turned on, they'll go to your GPS.

DJI drones start transmitting to Aeroscope as soon as you turn it on, so a good alternative is to turn it the drone and the controller on way before the flight and wait to see if someone comes, for about 15-40 minutes, just like setting a trap. If someone comes, you didn't fly, so you are good to go. If no one comes, it's pretty sure that there's no Aeroscope nearby. You will lose one battery charge, but if you never flew in that place befor is a good strategy.

And the last alternative is private property, fly from a fenced area, For example in Spain flying in the red areas doing photos is just a fault, not a crime and police can't enter private property unless they have a court order. But depends on the laws of every country.

I doubt that a European police force from a large country, guarding a head of state will be using DJI Aeroscope, given that 1. DJI is aligned with Chinese military and 2. it only detects DJI drones, meaning around 30% of consumer drones are not detectable.

I think they will be using a similar/more advanced product supplied to them by a national military contractor which can detect all drone flights. You can find a lot of info about these systems online. For example, in Germany the Federal Police use one supplied by Rohde & Schwarz for VIP protection: Countering drones

Your approach to spoof them might work regardless, but it may not. Police may not dispatch immediately, it may be low priority. Also remember that sometimes you may take off in a green or orange area and then inadvertently fly into a red zone.

 

[lostit]

How do you register with the EASA if you are not in a member state ? (UK) it seems impossible, it says to register with your member state. So they don't want anyone else flying in the EU? I'm registered with the CAA and I have an operator ID that seems to follow the EASA guide lines.

I recently flew in Majorca over the sea and a built up area with a Mini 2 but not over people on the beach.

 

[Yaros]

Firstly, this is completely absurd. Yes, Palma is a no-fly zone in most parts, however if you're not flying in CTR or Cala Mayor Prohibited airspace, should be fine. I took off in Palma 1 year ago, nothing happened really, no one came to complain.

I didn't know Palma had Aeroscope, but maybe it does after seeing this. I am completely against aeroscope and other tracking methods where the location of the pilot is revealed.

Secondly, how do they calculate those fines? It really looks to me like they put them in a random number generator from 600 to 250,000!

And most importantly, I hate the fact that Spain (and some other countries too) treat drones like weapons! They may well be used for something bad, but they need to understand that 99% of people flying drones nowadays use them for good purposes.

Also, not to mention, how disrespectful police can be to drone pilots in Spain is just incredible. I experienced this firsthand the other day.

 

[Cymru]

Never ever rely on the DJI apps to tell you if it's a no fly zone or not.
They're woefully inaccurate, out of date and don't display short term NOTAMs.

You always use whatever the official data set is for the country you're in.

As for these idiots, they did not research (or couldn't be bothered) to comply with the laws and registration for the drone so deserve their fines.

On top of that, if there was an officially published no fly out restriction zone around the VIP and they violated that, smack a large fine on them for that as well.

These types of incident are why we can't have nice things.

If you're visiting a country:
(I) Register, label and comply with any local regulations for using a drone
(Ii) Use the official data sources for where you can and can't fly.

 

[MS Coast]

Firstly, this is completely absurd. Yes, Palma is a no-fly zone in most parts, however if you're not flying in CTR or Cala Mayor Prohibited airspace, should be fine. I took off in Palma 1 year ago, nothing happened really, no one came to complain.

I didn't know Palma had Aeroscope, but maybe it does after seeing this. I am completely against aeroscope and other tracking methods where the location of the pilot is revealed.

Secondly, how do they calculate those fines? It really looks to me like they put them in a random number generator from 600 to 250,000!

And most importantly, I hate the fact that Spain (and some other countries too) treat drones like weapons! They may well be used for something bad, but they need to understand that 99% of people flying drones nowadays use them for good purposes.

Also, not to mention, how disrespectful police can be to drone pilots in Spain is just incredible. I experienced this firsthand the other day.

"if you're not flying in CTR or Cala Mayor Prohibited airspace, should be fine. I took off in Palma 1 year ago, nothing happened really, no one came to complain."

Beware anecdotal evidence. This is a little like saying, "A friend flew back from vacation in Mexico with a pound of cocaine and no one complained, so you should be fine doing the same."

 

[MS Coast]

How do you register with the EASA if you are not in a member state ? (UK) it seems impossible, it says to register with your member state. So they don't want anyone else flying in the EU? I'm registered with the CAA and I have an operator ID that seems to follow the EASA guide lines.

I recently flew in Majorca over the sea and a built up area with a Mini 2 but not over people on the beach.

EASA regulations do allow for registration by non-citizens. I'm a US citizen and I registered in Ireland. No problem.

 

[Cymru]

EASA regulations do allow for registration by non-citizens. I'm a US citizen and I registered in Ireland. No problem.

In theory you register with the first country its used in.
In reality some have English exams and others dont. Ireland, Cyprus, Luxemburg for example do. Just use one of those.
Practically speaking it really doesn't matter where.
No citizenship, visa, permits required other than an ID check (passport, driving licence etc). The whole process including exam takes about 30 mins after the initial slight delay to verify ID.

FWIW a UK registration (and A2CoC) although very similar are not identical and are not cross-recognised.

 

[MS Coast]

In theory you register with the first country its used in.
In reality some have English exams and others dont. Ireland, Cyprus, Luxemburg for example do. Just use one of those.
Practically speaking it really doesn't matter where.
No citizenship, visa, permits required other than an ID check (passport, driving licence etc). The whole process including exam takes about 30 mins after the initial slight delay to verify ID.

FWIW a UK registration (and A2CoC) although very similar are not identical and are not cross-recognised.

I recall that someone posted recently that a non-English speaking EU country offered registration in English and without a fee. Registering in Ireland cost about $30 earlier this year.

 

[Aerophile]

I recall that someone posted recently that a non-English speaking EU country offered registration in English and without a fee. Registering in Ireland cost about $30 earlier this year.

I beleive that example cited was Lichtenstein.

 

[Aerophile]

Beware anecdotal evidence. This is a little like saying that a friend flew back from vacation in Mexico with a pound of cocaine and no one complained, so you should be fine doing the same.

Hey, I've traveled all over the world and had unprotected sex with hundreds of strangers in very sketchy circumstances, I never once used "protection" and haven't caught a single STD yet. I recommend you do the same. No worries, go have your fun, you'll be perfectly OK, really!!!

(Note to those without any common sense: the above is sarcasm, not an actual recommendation...)

 

[Yaros]

Beware anecdotal evidence. This is a little like saying, "A friend flew back from vacation in Mexico with a pound of cocaine and no one complained, so you should be fine doing the same."

What I'm saying is that I was flying legally, not inside CTR nor Restricted Airspace.
If you fly illegally there then you're probably going to get caught by Aeroscope or another drone tracking system, so I will not try that.