Here’s the reference page from the FAA website. Also remember that, whether they actually legal or not, LEO are charged to enforce local laws/ordinances also.
Public Safety and Law Enforcement Toolkit
www.faa.gov
Taking By POLICE
- Thread starter ericpoche
- Start date
www.faa.gov
Old newsHere’s the reference page from the FAA website. Also remember that, whether they actually legal or not, LEO are charged to enforce local laws/ordinances also.
Public Safety and Law Enforcement Toolkit
Bigbird48
Well-Known Member
I know I posted but then I watched the video so just dbl cking rules seem to change every 5 minsHuh? You even posted in the thread about night flying bud. It has not changed.
Confused about flying at night
My buddy ask me if I can fly my drone at night? I never had in the past so I started to see if I could. I've found a bunch of info and I'm still not sure. Currently.....can a hobbyist fly a drone at night in the US? Thanksmavicpilots.com
As of right now HOBBYIST can fly at night in G Airspace so long as you follow all other rules & regs pertaining to hobby flights. You can be sure that when/if the FAA says no hobby flights at night it will be VERY publicized because many (pretty much almost all) hobbyist fly at night at least once in a while.
Sorry to pop your bubble but if they want to take your drone they have every right say thanks to the FAA.
Skywatcher2001
Well-Known Member
Not sure where you got your info but I'd really like to read it. LEO's cannot violate you 4th Amendment rights (they can but it's illegal). This is from the FAA's toolkit to LEA:
There you go again Skywatcher, citing that ancient obsolete document. When will you learn it doesn’t apply when it comes to drones SMH
Mavic Mac
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I wasn't going to enter into this discussion because I wasn't there and don't know all the facts and also posts are getting redundant. To address the question concerning if the LEOs were legal in taking the drone. If they believed a crime existed and they were concerned evidence of the crime would be destroyed (sd card reformatted - internal memory erased) they could seize the drone.
HERE is a link to the full article from which the below excerpts were taken.
A warrantless search is not unconstitutional when probable cause to search exists and the government satisfies its burden of demonstrating that the circumstances of the situation made a warrantless search imperative. State v. Allison, 298 N.C. 135, 257 S.E.2d 417 (1979). Some of the more significant exceptions to the warrant requirement are discussed below.
Exigent Circumstances. A warrantless search is permitted when probable cause to search exists and officers reasonably believe that contraband or other evidence may be destroyed or removed before a search warrant could be obtained. Mincey v. Arizona, 437 U.S. 385 (1978). Likewise, exigent circumstances also permit a warrantless entry or search while a warrant is being obtained, and may excuse the failure to knock and announcement” before entry. United States Cephas, 254 F.3d 488 (4th Cir. 2001); State v. Harris, 145 N.C. App. 734, 562 S.E.2d 499 (2001); State v. Woods, 136 N.C. App. 630, 571 S.E.2d 592 (2000).
Exigent circumstances exist when there is a situation that demands immediate action necessitating unusual action and circumvention of usual procedures. State v. Nance, 149 N.C. App. 734, 562 S.E.2d 557 (2002).The state has the burden of proving that the exigencies of the situation made search without a warrant imperative. State v. Allison, 298 N.C. 135, 257 S.E.2d 417 (1979).
Circumstances which may be sufficient to qualify as exigent for purposes of a warrant exception include the probable destruction of evidence, such as controlled substances. State v. Nowell, 144 N.C. App. 636, 550 S.E.2d 807 (2001). The exigent circumstances exception may apply where police are responding to an emergency or where there is a Jeanette Doran Brooks Institute of Government November 2004 2 compelling need for official action and no time to secure a warrant. State v. Phillips, 151 N.C. App. 185, 565 S.E.2d 697 (2002).
HERE is a link to the full article from which the below excerpts were taken.
A warrantless search is not unconstitutional when probable cause to search exists and the government satisfies its burden of demonstrating that the circumstances of the situation made a warrantless search imperative. State v. Allison, 298 N.C. 135, 257 S.E.2d 417 (1979). Some of the more significant exceptions to the warrant requirement are discussed below.
Exigent Circumstances. A warrantless search is permitted when probable cause to search exists and officers reasonably believe that contraband or other evidence may be destroyed or removed before a search warrant could be obtained. Mincey v. Arizona, 437 U.S. 385 (1978). Likewise, exigent circumstances also permit a warrantless entry or search while a warrant is being obtained, and may excuse the failure to knock and announcement” before entry. United States Cephas, 254 F.3d 488 (4th Cir. 2001); State v. Harris, 145 N.C. App. 734, 562 S.E.2d 499 (2001); State v. Woods, 136 N.C. App. 630, 571 S.E.2d 592 (2000).
Exigent circumstances exist when there is a situation that demands immediate action necessitating unusual action and circumvention of usual procedures. State v. Nance, 149 N.C. App. 734, 562 S.E.2d 557 (2002).The state has the burden of proving that the exigencies of the situation made search without a warrant imperative. State v. Allison, 298 N.C. 135, 257 S.E.2d 417 (1979).
Circumstances which may be sufficient to qualify as exigent for purposes of a warrant exception include the probable destruction of evidence, such as controlled substances. State v. Nowell, 144 N.C. App. 636, 550 S.E.2d 807 (2001). The exigent circumstances exception may apply where police are responding to an emergency or where there is a Jeanette Doran Brooks Institute of Government November 2004 2 compelling need for official action and no time to secure a warrant. State v. Phillips, 151 N.C. App. 185, 565 S.E.2d 697 (2002).
TheFoxSaysRingADingDing
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So I'm confused, if I'm at the park and fly behind a tree for a minute to get a better picture of something and a LEO came up and said "Hi, may I ask where is your drone?" and I said "It's right behind that tree officer", the LEO can legally can take down all my information, put it in their database and send it to the the FAA for briefly losing VLOS? Or, as been stated before that I have the right to not say anything, can I remain silent and make the LEO look for my drone? I guess that question kind of feels like how you would respond if you get pulled over and are asked "do you know how fast you were going?"
And this isn't a sarcastic questions (although I am a very sarcastic kind of guy most of the time).
Skywatcher2001
Well-Known Member
Skywatcher2001
Well-Known Member
It is a sensible question. The correct response would be; it depends on which LEO you get on that particular day. If the LEO does a simple check (within the law) to make sure you are compliant then no harm no foul. But, if the LEO comes off cocky, arrogant and full of himself then cooperate with him and 'respectively remind him' of your 1st, 4th and 5th Amendment rights. Hopefully he has on a body cam (activated) and that should put him in his legal place. But honestly, they (LEO's) have better things to do than hassle drone pilots.
Skywatcher2001
Well-Known Member
Thank you for that Mavic Mac. It's the law and most of us believe (and agree) with it. Recent cases posted on this forum about drones over stadiums, power plants and the such (I believe) warrants all the actions you call out. But, not the occasional night time flyer. Once again, it helps to have a sane, professional voice added to the discussion.
Were you flying close to the river? There have been complaints of drones flying at night around the unloading of barges. The FBI/police said the drones were distracting the crane operators.
Am I too new to call BS on this post? The first signal on the BS meter was right at the beginning when 5.... not 1 or 2 but.... 5 cops showed up.... too many holes in this "story" for it to be true. 5 cops wouldn't conspire to take your drone or even file a criminal TP charge on ya.... At best you might get a warning.... sorry.... just not a believable scenario....
John Locke
Well-Known Member
This is why I never fly at home. You never know if a neighbor will cause trouble, and you typically won't know who it is. I also don't want to make enemies with neighbors. It's always best to fly where you truly thinks it's legal to fly, outside your neighborhood.
In a case like this, it's easier to simply lie to the cop if he didn't see you flying. NEVER ADMIT to flying drones to a LEO if he didn't see you himself. Even if he sees your drone stuff after you have flown, you can say "I was getting ready to fly, I've seen others fly here, is that OK?" If he says no, then just apologize and leave.
In this case you could have said, oh yeah, my friend came by to show me his drone and flew it a little bit. He just left. Did he do something wrong? The cop can't force you to disclose any names of others. Or just deny knowing his last name. It ends there. Easier to lie about it, and you've learned a lesson of where not to fly.
Anytime I'm flying, I try to fly as stealth as best possible, mitigating the possibility of someone calling a LEO. This means I use a launch site where few can see me launch or navigate. My backpack allows me to easily hike to such places and fly with privacy. This also mitigates people from asking all those questions (how far, how long, etc). Sometimes I'll have to wait for the right time to launch, with the fewest people walking by. And after takeoff, I try to remain hard to see me, navigating with the remote for the duration of the flight, while staying somewhat hidden out of sight. I've been know to hide in bushes, for the shade and stealth benefits. Yes, sometimes this means flying FPV, practically the whole time.
Sometimes I'll elect to launch and navigate from INSIDE my car. I'll prepare the drone inside the car first, then quickly place the drone a few feet in front of the car and turn it on. Then I get back inside the car and wait for the right time to take off, with the least people nearby. This only recommended with Lightbridge/OcuSync equipped drones. I can usually fly up to a mile away from inside the car. If by chance a LEO shows up and starts looking around, I'll park the drone in the sky 300' high near the sun where most difficult to see, then drive my car blocks away to retrieve the drone (I've only had to do that once). If you ever have to do that, point the camera at the COP car so you can see if he leaves, or where he goes, after you drive away. Also, even when you don't suspect a LEO is in the area when landing in a busy area, look around your area with your drone camera for COP cars. You can see much better from up high than from inside your car. It's best to avoid versus confront.
In a case like this, it's easier to simply lie to the cop if he didn't see you flying. NEVER ADMIT to flying drones to a LEO if he didn't see you himself. Even if he sees your drone stuff after you have flown, you can say "I was getting ready to fly, I've seen others fly here, is that OK?" If he says no, then just apologize and leave.
In this case you could have said, oh yeah, my friend came by to show me his drone and flew it a little bit. He just left. Did he do something wrong? The cop can't force you to disclose any names of others. Or just deny knowing his last name. It ends there. Easier to lie about it, and you've learned a lesson of where not to fly.
Anytime I'm flying, I try to fly as stealth as best possible, mitigating the possibility of someone calling a LEO. This means I use a launch site where few can see me launch or navigate. My backpack allows me to easily hike to such places and fly with privacy. This also mitigates people from asking all those questions (how far, how long, etc). Sometimes I'll have to wait for the right time to launch, with the fewest people walking by. And after takeoff, I try to remain hard to see me, navigating with the remote for the duration of the flight, while staying somewhat hidden out of sight. I've been know to hide in bushes, for the shade and stealth benefits. Yes, sometimes this means flying FPV, practically the whole time.
Sometimes I'll elect to launch and navigate from INSIDE my car. I'll prepare the drone inside the car first, then quickly place the drone a few feet in front of the car and turn it on. Then I get back inside the car and wait for the right time to take off, with the least people nearby. This only recommended with Lightbridge/OcuSync equipped drones. I can usually fly up to a mile away from inside the car. If by chance a LEO shows up and starts looking around, I'll park the drone in the sky 300' high near the sun where most difficult to see, then drive my car blocks away to retrieve the drone (I've only had to do that once). If you ever have to do that, point the camera at the COP car so you can see if he leaves, or where he goes, after you drive away. Also, even when you don't suspect a LEO is in the area when landing in a busy area, look around your area with your drone camera for COP cars. You can see much better from up high than from inside your car. It's best to avoid versus confront.
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You have what seems like a weak case: flying at night, over people? oops! And "flying from my own property" counts for nothing - what counts is where your drone was... I sympathize, but advise that you use better discretion when flying near people. The wilderness is the best place for a drone, or at least high up during daylight. These police interventions are only going to get worse, not better.
hunterws
Active Member
Jets fly over my house on a daily basis, can I sue them for trespassing?!? (no)
This should get in front of a judge, so they can slap the overbearing cops on the hand.
It seems everyone here has only been discussing federal law. If he was cited for “criminal trespass” in Louisiana, that is a Louisiana state law RS 14:63, created after a dispute where a neighbor shot a drone down with a shotgun.
The trespassing laws were basically expanded to include flying over private property with the intent to engage in surveillance. The law was amended to stipulate that this doesn’t apply to anyone compliant with federal law, I suspect because the FAA has sole jurisdiction over U.S. airspace.
I’m anxious to see how the state drone laws in LA play out in the courts. There are also laws that make it illegal to photograph “critical infrastructure” (refineries) and others that are much more specific that criminalize peeping Tom activity.
Louisiana Drone Laws from Attorney & Pilot -
www.legis.la.gov
The trespassing laws were basically expanded to include flying over private property with the intent to engage in surveillance. The law was amended to stipulate that this doesn’t apply to anyone compliant with federal law, I suspect because the FAA has sole jurisdiction over U.S. airspace.
I’m anxious to see how the state drone laws in LA play out in the courts. There are also laws that make it illegal to photograph “critical infrastructure” (refineries) and others that are much more specific that criminalize peeping Tom activity.
Louisiana Drone Laws from Attorney & Pilot -
Louisiana Laws - Louisiana State Legislature
www.legis.la.gov
A lot of local LEOs are ignorant of the laws (State, local and especially federal). In some cases their training has not caught up with the laws, in others, the laws have yet to be created to deal with the nuances of technology.... I know this is a generalization and there are a lot of great LEOs out there serving and protecting. Either way, it’s up to us to do “everything right”. You did everything correctly; Know your rights, know the laws, have your paperwork and above all DO NOT resist a request from a LEO on scene. The worse thing you can do is to make them feel “ignorant” is escalate the situation and then you are taken in for a trumped up disorderly or disturbing the peace charge. Then at a minimum comes a court appearance, lawyer and court fees and so on! Hassles you don’t need. The best suggestion during and after the encounter is; fully cooperate, document the incident with video and audio if possible and then make a claim at the station with the desk sergeant or civilian liaison. If you can’t get satisfaction there, try the district attorney’s office. If all else fails, sue the city!
Roc Rat
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