Advice on Insurance amount

[Emexrulsier]

Hey all, I am new to the world of Drone, I recommended to my company that we get one purely for using on site for surveys and aerial photograpy that we may use for websites marketing etc. All work is to only be carried out on company premises, but we still need public liablity insurance. My question is how much /shrug.

I am in the UK, and going to all the sites for quotes they ask you how much you want, often starting at £1,000,000 up to around £25,000,000. I am not wanting to cover the drone itself, just liabilty but it all seems very vague. My risks to public would be very low but the questions all seems to be based on "how long is a piece of string".

So from advice from all you frequent drone flyers, possibly people who are using them like myself, restricted to within certain locations what would you recommend as a minimum?

 

[Cafguy]

I don't think any insurance company would take your word about only flying at a certain area.
My insurance company only has one policy for drones. It includes the cost of the drone and any damages i may cause.
I don't know of any that offer a variety of drone policies BUT I live in the U.S.
AND Welcome to the Forum from Bakersfield.

 

[Emexrulsier]

Yeah the policy quotes I have been getting into do cover me for worldworld flying (baring some countries), I guess its down to an internal risk assessement, but still dunno what amount to get. Unless we say only fly if the elderly are walking past

 

[CadrePilot]

Unless you can strictly define the potential amount of damages, you should insure based on the value of your assets to protect them from suit/loss.

 

[Emexrulsier]

Unless you can strictly define the potential amount of damages, you should insure based on the value of your assets to protect them from suit/loss.

Its public liability not assets

 

[CadrePilot]

Its public liability not assets

You get insurance to protect yourself from losing your assets when you're sued and found liable.

 

[Gazwas]

CAA require minimum of £750,000 for commercial insurance so unless you are doing some particularly demanding flights £1M is all that is required.

 

[Gazwas]

You get insurance to protect yourself from losing your assets when you're sued and found liable.

Not sure it works that way in the UK.

 

[CadrePilot]

Not sure it works that way in the UK.

If you injure someone, can they sue you?
Are the amounts they can sue you for limited?

 

[Emexrulsier]

If you injure someone, can they sue you?
Are the amounts they can sue you for limited?

They could sue you yes, that why you get public liability. If you hit someone it could be minor but still have a charge, but if you disabled someone for life the costs could be huge.

You may also need insurance to cover, property damage. At the end of the day no one cares about your own equipment (only the user) you are covering yourself against a potential third party claim be it person or property.

 

[Cafguy]

Who insures the company? After all if you will be flying the drone on their property, conducting that companies business, then you may already have coverage (probably not) BUT that companies insurance company will tell you weather you are covered for Drone activities on their property or if they are covered to conduct business with drones. I fly security for a company- They had to have their policy amended to include drone activity on their own property to be covered. If I crash and hit one of the employees their own policy covers that.
However-If I fly intentionally and crash off the property The hospital bill would be on me or my insurance company. I would think that you would need a separate policy and explanations from the businesses insurance co. that they are also covered for your flight.

 

[Felix le Chat]

Hey all, I am new to the world of Drone, I recommended to my company that we get one purely for using on site for surveys and aerial photograpy that we may use for websites marketing etc. All work is to only be carried out on company premises, but we still need public liablity insurance. My question is how much /shrug.

I am in the UK, and going to all the sites for quotes they ask you how much you want, often starting at £1,000,000 up to around £25,000,000. I am not wanting to cover the drone itself, just liabilty but it all seems very vague. My risks to public would be very low but the questions all seems to be based on "how long is a piece of string".

So from advice from all you frequent drone flyers, possibly people who are using them like myself, restricted to within certain locations what would you recommend as a minimum?

Try joining the Grey Arrows, insurance cover through that club can be 3rd party only. £12 million P&P + £10K personal injury will set you back £29 p/a for a recreational policy. Commercial insurance is more expensive but can be arranged if you provide proof of appropriate certification (A2CofC+GVC).
If this is "exclusively work related", then whoever you work for is obliged to carry public & private liability insurance as part of their business. Get them to arrange cover through their current provider.
But before you step into the professional use of drones for commercial purposes, you WILL need to gain officially recognised certification AND insurance as the PIC before you start putting any drone up in the air. You also need to head over to the CAA website to register yourself as a drone flier, then read through the CAP722 suite of documents to familiarise yourself with the current rules and regulations governing the use of drones in a public environment.

 

[Gazwas]

Try joining the Grey Arrows, insurance cover through that club can be 3rd party only. £12 million P&P + £10K personal injury will set you back £29 p/a for a recreational policy. Commercial insurance is more expensive but can be arranged if you provide proof of appropriate certification (A2CofC+GVC).
If this is "exclusively work related", then whoever you work for is obliged to carry public & private liability insurance as part of their business. Get them to arrange cover through their current provider.
But before you step into the professional use of drones for commercial purposes, you WILL need to gain officially recognised certification AND insurance as the PIC before you start putting any drone up in the air. You also need to head over to the CAA website to register yourself as a drone flier, then read through the CAP722 suite of documents to familiarise yourself with the current rules and regulations governing the use of drones in a public environment.

I had a look at the Grey Arrows following your recommendation for insurance but they exclude:

• Business or commercial operations of any kind

@Emexrulsier it might be worth discussing public liability amounts with the client you are flying for and possibly some others to get a gauge of what is expected.

For my photo/video business I have some clients who demand a specific amount of public liability before being allowed on site. Most of my clients state a number and have had one who required £10M cover. I currently have £5M cover for public liability (on the ground only) and looking myself for drone cover to match.

 

[Emexrulsier]

Who insures the company? After all if you will be flying the drone on their property, conducting that companies business, then you may already have coverage (probably not) BUT that companies insurance company will tell you weather you are covered for Drone activities on their property or if they are covered to conduct business with drones. I fly security for a company- They had to have their policy amended to include drone activity on their own property to be covered. If I crash and hit one of the employees their own policy covers that.
However-If I fly intentionally and crash off the property The hospital bill would be on me or my insurance company. I would think that you would need a separate policy and explanations from the businesses insurance co. that they are also covered for your flight.

I did enquire with our company insurance, drones are not covered. They wanted to charge me about 1K a year just for public liabilty (10mil).

 

[Emexrulsier]

Try joining the Grey Arrows, insurance cover through that club can be 3rd party only. £12 million P&P + £10K personal injury will set you back £29 p/a for a recreational policy. Commercial insurance is more expensive but can be arranged if you provide proof of appropriate certification (A2CofC+GVC).
If this is "exclusively work related", then whoever you work for is obliged to carry public & private liability insurance as part of their business. Get them to arrange cover through their current provider.
But before you step into the professional use of drones for commercial purposes, you WILL need to gain officially recognised certification AND insurance as the PIC before you start putting any drone up in the air. You also need to head over to the CAA website to register yourself as a drone flier, then read through the CAP722 suite of documents to familiarise yourself with the current rules and regulations governing the use of drones in a public environment.

Business public & private liability doesn't cover drone usage (tbh I dont think and normal business insurance would). We all have flyer ids and the required operation ids and a few of use have flown for hobbies before, but now the business would like to use them we need insurance, hence my OP.

 

[Emexrulsier]

I had a look at the Grey Arrows following your recommendation for insurance but they exclude:

• Business or commercial operations of any kind

@Emexrulsier it might be worth discussing public liability amounts with the client you are flying for and possibly some others to get a gauge of what is expected.

For my photo/video business I have some clients who demand a specific amount of public liability before being allowed on site. Most of my clients state a number and have had one who required £10M cover. I currently have £5M cover for public liability (on the ground only) and looking myself for drone cover to match.

Yeah cheers, we are the client, we aren't selling drone services, its just we need insurances because its commercial. 95% of the flights would be on our own private land, but there are fishing lakes near by, and a couple of roads, its all about "what if" something happened and the drone veered off and causes injury, or damaged the proeprty of the old lady who house is on the side of the lake

 

[Gazwas]

Yeah cheers, we are the client, we aren't selling drone services, its just we need insurances because its commercial. 95% of the flights would be on our own private land, but there are fishing lakes near by, and a couple of roads, its all about "what if" something happened and the drone veered off and causes injury, or damaged the proeprty of the old lady who house is on the side of the lake

Being for commercial flight the pilot needs the minimum legal requirement set by the CAA of £750K. As most policies start at £1M that's all you need.

As this is over private land its then imperative that as the pilot you do adequate pre flight planning and risk assessment that you don't incur unnecessary flight risk. e.g fly with a spotter, avoiding the old ladies house, plan the flight away from the roads or close the road if private or have a spotter on the road communicating the traffic situation and lastly, don't dive bomb fishermen.

 

[Kuiper Denizen]

The first thing that liability insurance is going give you, in my opinion, is a lawyer to defend the case and to negotiate the amount of damages owed if the plaintiff wins.

I wouldn’t want to do that on my own!

The next thing insurance is going to pay is the actual damages owed, up to the coverage amount. (I’m not sure if legal fees are included in that amount. You should ask.)

Years ago I owned a canoe livery. I had my customers sign a waiver, knowing that would never protect me from an accident due to any negligence on my company’s part.

I also realized that friendships and relationships, even by blood, meant nothing if my negligence led to an accident followed by a lifetime of financial hardship for the recipient of my failure to do my due diligence! (Recreational flyers take note!)

The key to avoiding losing a lawsuit is to make sure a you and/or the company have a stringent safety policy. Even if you’re exonerated, you still have those legal fees to consider if you have no insurance, though.

So how much coverage do you get, knowing you could be faced with a financial obligation that you could never meet?

First figure out how no-exceptions-allowed your safety rules are. The pilot in charge is the first one facing the liability. The deep pocket is always the one a plaintiff goes after, so the company is next.

Remember, any innocent victim of an avoidable accident deserves to be recompensed for his/her loss if it’s your action or inaction that caused it.

Even if you’re just a recreational flyer, if you do something stupid you’re the one held responsible.

For all the bellyaching and complaining some do about F.A.A. regulations, those rules, if followed, protect the pilot in charge.

Being legal is the first line of defense. Insurance is only needed to insure that good legal advice and defense is there when you need it.

If you expect there might be damages to pay, then buy an amount that will cover your innate recklessness and disregard for safety!!

Good luck in guessing that cap.

And remember, your insurance company may well inspect your rules of operation and have a clause that gets them off the hook if you break any rules!

From a guy who is a past owner of liability insurance he never needed.

 

[Felix le Chat]

I had a look at the Grey Arrows following your recommendation for insurance but they exclude:

• Business or commercial operations of any kind

@Emexrulsier it might be worth discussing public liability amounts with the client you are flying for and possibly some others to get a gauge of what is expected.

For my photo/video business I have some clients who demand a specific amount of public liability before being allowed on site. Most of my clients state a number and have had one who required £10M cover. I currently have £5M cover for public liability (on the ground only) and looking myself for drone cover to match.

I don't think I articulated myself particularly well in my earlier response. "...Commercial insurance is more expensive but can be arranged if you provide proof of appropriate certification (A2CofC+GVC)..." should have had the words "...through other companies..." between the word "arranged" and the word "if".

A ten second Google search threw up:
FLYCOVERED - commercial drone insurance.
TOWERGATE - commercial drone insurance.
HELIGUY - drone insurance for commercial pilots.
GALLAGHER UK - commercial drone insurance.
All of the above are UK based. As is the provider named below.

In addition to MOONROCK - commercial drone insurance (bespoke cover) This starts at a monthly premium of £31 for: materials damage cover (£2,000) and public & private liability cover (£1 million) but being bespoke - you can increase the cover amounts according to your requirements, but obviously the premium will increase as well.
...and as it happens: MOONROCK the company I'm now going to be using when my own renewal comes up.

I'd love to see the delicate hazard to drone flight that would require more than £1,000,000 to put right after a small plastic drone in tripod mode grazed it. Sounds like this 'client' was taking you for a right Charlie... unless he wanted an overflight of his Faberge Egg collection.

I photograph scheduled monuments and Grade #1 list historic buildings and the only offhand question I've ever been asked on two occasions is: "...do you have to have insurance to fly these things?..." In five years I've never even been asked to produce my cover documents, but they get shown anyway.

 

[Gazwas]

I'd love to see the delicate hazard to drone flight that would require more than £1,000,000 to put right after a small plastic drone in tripod mode grazed it. Sounds like this 'client' was taking you for a right Charlie... unless he wanted an overflight of his Faberge Egg collection.

£10M Cover was required for just keeping my feet firmly on the ground. Thats what you get for working with a large chain of UK shopping centres where there are lots of people itching to trip over a misplaced lens cap.