Corp of Engineers Dams & Locks no fly zones?

[macoman]

I just don't understand why a dam is a national security issue... Is just water... Not a power plant.. lol.

 

[Paulf10]

I used to be a USACE Park Ranger, she was acting on what she was trained with- there is a lot of misinformation being handed out about who has jurisdiction of airspace. Had she cited and asked for your drone, you’d be at a hearing in a Federal Magistrates courtroom asking for it back after your case was dismissed. You avoided a big hassle by complying with her.

It would help if you sent a polite letter to her regional manager explaining the situation and how they can correct the information.

Avoiding a big hassle is always my prime objective. At 69 years old I just want to relax and enjoy my hobby of drone photography. If she had confiscated my drone than I’m more than up for a fight, but on the other hand I’d just as soon move on with a smile and find a more peaceful quite place to fly. Also I live in Massachusetts and if I thought a letter would do anymore than fall on deaf ears, I’d have already written it. I’d even be extremely happy if they just put up signs, which in fact the girl said they were in the process of doing. That was almost 2 years ago. Still no signs.

 

[dirkclod]

Well after 9-11 alot of things changed . We used to be able to drive up to the lock and look down at the catfish and throw em dog food but then they locked em down .Guess it was just a shotgun effect and I understand why. Some locks/dams could be messed up bad if they were to hit them .
Like if that dam was hit in the pictures above you think of the mess down stream and then farther.Lot of water behind those . Likely to happen I think not but guess thats the way they look at it.
Edit : we posted at the same time Paul,sorry.

 

[RayOZ]

I was having a chat with someone the other day. He was saying military see themselves differently that the rest, civilians. CASA in Australia only deals with civil aviation, and if the air force wants to fly through an air space, they don't have to ask permission. He said there was an incident where a police helicopter was chasing a stolen car and they flew too close to the airport. The pilots was properly chastised by CASA that the next time they do it, they lose their pilot's license. However, if an army helicopter were to do the same, CASA can't say anything. I might be wrong.
So perhaps, in US even if FAA app doesn't show it's a NFZ, if the military tells FAA it's a NFZ, it's up to FAA to update their app, they don't need to ask permission from FAA if they can make it a NFZ.

 

[sar104]

I was having a chat with someone the other day. He was saying military see themselves differently that the rest, civilians. CASA in Australia only deals with civil aviation, and if the air force wants to fly through an air space, they don't have to ask permission. He said there was an incident where a police helicopter was chasing a stolen car and they flew too close to the airport. The pilots was properly chastised by CASA that the next time they do it, they lose their pilot's license. However, if an army helicopter were to do the same, CASA can't say anything. I might be wrong.
So perhaps, in US even if FAA app doesn't show it's a NFZ, if the military tells FAA it's a NFZ, it's up to FAA to update their app, they don't need to ask permission from FAA if they can make it a NFZ.

No - that's not how it works in the US. Special Use airspace for military operations is defined by agreement between the DoD and the FAA. NFZs can be put in place by a similar process.

 

[kadras]

Doing some research, I found several Corps of Engineers districts that cite US Code of Federal Regulations Title 36, Chapter III, Section 327.4 (36CFR327.4) for their ban on UAVs. Title 36 is Parks, Forests and Public Property and includes the National Park Service, US Forest Service, Army Corps of Engineers (Chapter III, starting with part 300) and other agencies.

PART 327—RULES AND REGULATIONS GOVERNING PUBLIC USE OF WATER RESOURCE DEVELOPMENT PROJECTS ADMINISTERED BY THE CHIEF OF ENGINEERS
§ 327.4 Aircraft.
(a) This section pertains to all aircraft including, but not limited to, airplanes, seaplanes, helicopters, ultralight aircraft, motorized hang gliders, hot air balloons, any non-powered flight devices or any other such equipment.
(b) The operation of aircraft on project lands at locations other than those designated by the District Commander is prohibited.
(c) No person shall operate any aircraft while on or above project waters or project lands in a careless, negligent or reckless manner so as to endanger any person, property or environmental feature.
(d) Nothing in this section bestows authority to deviate from rules and regulations or prescribed standards of the appropriate State Aeronautical Agency, or the Federal Aviation Administration, including, but not limited to, regulations and standards concerning pilot certifications or ratings, and airspace requirements.

I'm no lawyer and not here to argue it, but this reads like the same bureaucracy we go through elsewhere.
Section (b) states "on" project lands is prohibited
Section (c) state "on or above" and is about safe flying operations
Section (d) states that this section doesn't bestow authority to deviate from rules and regulations of the FAA. This would seem to allow flying.
Section (f) deals specifically with seaplanes, and then the entire section 328 is devoted to seaplane operations.

So being able to fly or not is based on the interest of the District Commander (or authorized representative).

 

[Starz]

I kept thinking for some reason ........................................................................
..............................................................................test case?
Would make for an interesting read.

 

[Drone Or Boat]

Ten-Tom waterway sees a lot of Great Loopers. Hope to do that myself one day. Looking for the right boat now. I was hoping to record most of the trip with my Mavic. Looks like I may have some issues with a few of my shots. There is 166 locks to go through on the trip and wanted to shoot them from a different angle than most Looper's.

 

[Jive]

Thanks for all the replies so far! Please note that I am not at all upset that we were told we couldn't fly there, however, if they are right, then those sites need added to the apps to prevent people from doing what we did.

I do have an FAA contact, and am going to run it by him. If I find out anything, I will let you know.

 

[terradriller]

Thanks for all the replies so far! Please note that I am not at all upset that we were told we couldn't fly there, however, if they are right, then those sites need added to the apps to prevent people from doing what we did.

I do have an FAA contact, and am going to run it by him. If I find out anything, I will let you know.View attachment 58174

Cute pic...they make a nice couple

 

[Rich55]

NASHVILLE, Tenn. (Nov. 6, 2018) — The public is reminded of the policies of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers Nashville District and Tennessee Valley Authority that govern the operation and use of recreational unmanned aerial systems (UAS or drones) . The Corps of Engineers operates and maintains navigation locks at TVA dams where the TVA drone policy applies.

Note sure where you fly, but the laws are always changing for us. This is for the Tennessee Valley Authority just done in November. Is the dam a power maker? That's a no no then.

Dam shame.

Do you have a copy of TVA Drone restrictions or a link. I live in the Middle TN area, there are several dams I would like to ge footage on myself.

 

[dirkclod]

Ten-Tom waterway sees a lot of Great Loopers. Hope to do that myself one day. Looking for the right boat now. I was hoping to record most of the trip with my Mavic. Looks like I may have some issues with a few of my shots. There is 166 locks to go through on the trip and wanted to shoot them from a different angle than most Looper's.

Loopers..what I see most of are snow birds going south then back up in the spring .
just screen shots from raw footage.
Just cut this for ya, ya never know what you gonna come up on.These boats where waiting to lock through and when he saw me I yawed back and forth like to wave at him when he saw me and he waved back .

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Lots of barge traffic also

 

[Rum_Runner]

I am new here, and have a semi related question. When i pull up b4ufly, it tells me i am in range of a small airport and 2 heliports.

The airport is not a concern as i can contact them easily. One of the heliports is a hospital, and the second is an eye surgery center.

When i called the eye center they stated that the heliport is no longer in use. Should it be removed from the b4ufly app?

 

[kadras]

Do you have a copy of TVA Drone restrictions or a link. I live in the Middle TN area, there are several dams I would like to ge footage on myself.

TVA Drone Rules
TVA - Rules for Use of TVA Public Lands
Public operation of drones is prohibited on and over all developed TVA public lands, facilities or structures--including but not limited to TVA dam reservations and developed recreation areas (such as campgrounds and day-use areas)—as well as power plant reservations, power substations and transmission lines, unless permitted by applicable law or regulation.

 

[AMann]

And USAC

I am new here, and have a semi related question. When i pull up b4ufly, it tells me i am in range of a small airport and 2 heliports.

The airport is not a concern as i can contact them easily. One of the heliports is a hospital, and the second is an eye surgery center.

When i called the eye center they stated that the heliport is no longer in use. Should it be removed from the b4ufly app?

There are several airfields like that, just keep a good record of your contact with them.

 

[Drone Or Boat]

Do you have a copy of TVA Drone restrictions or a link. I live in the Middle TN area, there are several dams I would like to ge footage on myself.

Give this a try; NR 18-030: Public reminded of drone policies at ... - Nashville Districthttps://www.lrn.usace.army.mil/.../nr-18-030-public-reminded-of-drone-policies-at-co...

 

[sar104]

Give this a try; NR 18-030: Public reminded of drone policies at ... - Nashville Districthttps://www.lrn.usace.army.mil/.../nr-18-030-public-reminded-of-drone-policies-at-co...

That's a weasely document that deliberately attempts to conflate authority on the ground with jurisdiction over airspace, primarily by introducing the concept of damage on the ground (harassing wildlife etc.). Disappointing from a Federal Agency.

 

[Drone Or Boat]

Loopers..what I see most of are snow birds going south then back up in the spring .
View attachment 58187View attachment 58188 just screen shots from raw footage.
Just cut this for ya, ya never know what you gonna come up on.These boats where waiting to lock through and when he saw me I yawed back and forth like to wave at him when he saw me and he waved back .

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Lots of barge traffic also

They are FOR SURE Loopers!!!

 

[Drone Or Boat]

That's a weasely document that deliberately attempts to conflate authority on the ground with jurisdiction over airspace, primarily by introducing the concept of damage on the ground (harassing wildlife etc.). Disappointing from a Federal Agency.

Sounds like the Everglades, here in Florida.

 

[Tbredhed]

I just don't understand why a dam is a national security issue... Is just water... Not a power plant.. lol.

Totally national security I would think, other than a nuke if you wanted to cause massive casualties destroy a dam. Everything for 10's to hundreds of miles would be destroyed!

I'm actually surprised dams aren't NFZ by default.
Cheers