Flight restriction in national parks.

[Gkinghrn]

is the answer to this not simply for the NPS to designate No Fly Zones within their parks and perhaps also additionaly request permit only flights within the other area's.

I think some regulation is fine (people without drones get annoyed when they fly over them usually) .... 'computer says no' isnt really a good argument in this day and age..

 

[Pontoon-pilot]

Establish no-fly zones in busy populated areas. But allow flight in wide-open areas where there is not a soul for miles. Banning all drones/photographers in all areas just because a few people were reckless is not a good solution.
I also would like to enjoy the peace and quiet in nature and respects other's desire wanting the same, I choose not to move in close and disturb them.
It would be nice if I could just "wish away" noisy people with many children running around wild in campgrounds or people with diesel truck idling and stinking up the place. But things don't work out that way.
Let us share common land, stop banning everything...that's my viewpoint.

 

[Drgnfli]

So they don't allow it because they interfere with wildlife. I get it. But I'll get on my soapbox.

WE are wildlife too. Just like any other sentient animal on the planet, we eat, sleep, drink, replicate, urinate, get old, and die. We are just gorillas that have evolved fast enough to have a written language and use tools.

So do we care if other animals interfere with other animals? Do we get upset if a wolf kills and eats a deer?

Look, I get it. I'm all for protecting the environment and not making animals go extinct. But out of all the things that us "humans" do to interfere with nature, flying a small drone is probably the lowest on the totem pole. The only things it's going to do is make other birds want to attack it. And 10/10 times, the non-plastic bird wins.

Us humans have really big egos. We think it's our job to police the world and keep wildlife in check. In reality, we are just existing like any other animal. Our prime directive is to survive and replicate before we die.

So this is just a rant. If drones really do cause great harm to wildlife, sure, ban them from parks. But I've never seen any data at all supporting this claim. Ok I could maybe see a drone scaring wildlife and making them run or fly away. But how is it REALLY any different than a predator scaring away wildlife? Because we are "humans"? So is it fine then if the mere act of walking or running through a park scares away wildlife? Lets just ban all humans from parks. Problem solved.

Can I borrow your words? Well said! ! ! ! I agree 100% !

 

[Drgnfli]

This is Virginia State Park rules not National Parks rules. While it is a similar and equally odd rule it is different.

Here in Utah drones are allowed in State Parks with the exception of Antelope Island which limits drones to a small window of the year.

To fly in the State Park you just need to pay a $5 fee and fill out an application for a permit but they are immediately and automatically granted as long as you provide the registration #. I find this to be an extremely reasonable process.

I wish that other State’s and NPS would adopt this procedure. I even think $5 is low. I’d be ok with $10-$20 at the state level and $50 at the National Park level.

Someone earlier mentioned that we need representation to fight for our interests and I totally agree. While organizations like the AMA have been doing what they thought was the right type of lobbying, it’s become obvious to me they have been too accommodating to the FAA and the FAA has taken advantage of the FAAs and DJIs willingness to co-operate with them. We need a special interest group like the NRA which takes a scorched earth approach. Love or hate the NRA no one can deny their effectiveness.

Paying $5 is about right for a one time permit but $50 - you must be rich!

 

[Drgnfli]

As for one of those people who were and ARE "contorting themselves into pretzels defending and justifying the National Park ban" I take offense to your words. I spend a LOT of time in the woods away from modern tech in order to enjoy nature "As it is". The last thing I want to see/hear is a noisy aUAS beebopping around and spoiling the whole reason we went into the woods to begin with. That's also why in many of "Said places" you won't see powered bikes, ATV's, 4x4 etc. Heck a lot of the NPS land where I am located is genuine Wilderness Area and they can't even place signage for hikers etc because it would spoil the WILDERNESS.

Go find somewhere else to fly that does NOT ruin it for those who are there to enjoy it as it is!!!

Don't agree! Wait a few minutes, the drone's battery will need charging & it will go away. Those Harley Davidson loud, obnoxious motorcycles can be heard 5 miles away in Yellowstone NP but they are allowed.

 

[BigAl07]

Don't agree! Wait a few minutes, the drone's battery will need charging & it will go away. Those Harley Davidson loud, obnoxious motorcycles can be heard 5 miles away in Yellowstone NP but they are allowed.

In places where MANY of our fellow members want to fly (not on the side of the highway/parking lot) those HD motorcycles are not allowed. Your rationale is heavily flawed.

 

[Drgnfli]

In places where MANY of our fellow members want to fly (not on the side of the highway/parking lot) those HD motorcycles are not allowed. Your rationale is heavily flawed.

"Flawed" ?? I've been to YNP five times in my lifetime, stayed at the motels there for a week or more at a time; worked there 2 summers which means I lived in the park. You can hear the HD motorcycles five (5) miles away coming toward you; when they pass near you, you can then listen to them for another five (5) miles going away from you. But! Let's not allow a puny little drone fly around the park for about 15 minutes per battery... How is that "flawed" thinking? Constant loud wildlife disturbing exhaust noise for about 30 minutes straight is OK but a drones little buzzy noise is not ok? OMG!

 

[bushie]

Were banned here in WA (That's Western Australia) National Parks up until about 12 months ago, when they saw the light. Now allowed so long as you comply with CASA regs and don't scare animals.

 

[Riteguy]

As for one of those people who were and ARE "contorting themselves into pretzels defending and justifying the National Park ban" I take offense to your words. I spend a LOT of time in the woods away from modern tech in order to enjoy nature "As it is". The last thing I want to see/hear is a noisy aUAS beebopping around and spoiling the whole reason we went into the woods to begin with. That's also why in many of "Said places" you won't see powered bikes, ATV's, 4x4 etc. Heck a lot of the NPS land where I am located is genuine Wilderness Area and they can't even place signage for hikers etc because it would spoil the WILDERNESS.

Go find somewhere else to fly that does NOT ruin it for those who are there to enjoy it as it is!!!

As a citizen of this country who has the same rights as you, how is it that we don't have equal opportunity to use our lands. Perhaps, a dedicated one or two days per week where drones are allowed to experience and film the wonders of nature. The complaint of noise in the areas can be extended to voices of the people who hike these trails and scare the wildlife, so do we ban all people from using our lands.

 

[sar104]

As a citizen of this country who has the same rights as you, how is it that we don't have equal opportunity to use our lands. Perhaps, a dedicated one or two days per week where drones are allowed to experience and film the wonders of nature. The complaint of noise in the areas can be extended to voices of the people who hike these trails and scare the wildlife, so do we ban all people from using our lands.

So what's your solution - unrestricted use of those lands? You want to fly your drone there. Others want to ride their dirt bikes and snowmobiles, or take their trucks offroading. What about their rights? You good with all of that, or just your drone?

 

[minipilotmda]

I totally agree. I live in middle Tennessee, just a few miles from Natchez Trace Parkway. I kindly requested permission to fly and get awesome pictures but was told no. National Park Service (NPS) owns the land, however FAA owns the airspace and most of the Parkway is Class G uncontrolled airspace. So Saturday (2/22/2020) I stood about a foot or 2 off NPS land and flew, knowing any park ranger couldn't cause me any trouble.
Tennessee state parks are almost as bad. Each individual park manager gets to decide, however state law says I can carry a gun into a state park but I can't fly a drone without park manager's permission, and so far 3 park managers have told me no.
So guns yes, drones no.

What's the rules in the GSMNP (great smoky mountain national park)?

 

[BigAl07]

What's the rules in the GSMNP (great smoky mountain national park)?

UAS are not allowed to be flown from GSMNP lands. They don't control over flight but you can't take-off/land on any GSMNP land. Your equipment could get confiscated.

If you go into a Wilderness areas you're not even supposed to have anything motorized on your person.

 

[scoble08]

So what's your solution - unrestricted use of those lands? You want to fly your drone there. Others want to ride their dirt bikes and snowmobiles, or take their trucks offroading. What about their rights? You good with all of that, or just your drone?

How about common sense, as related to this argument. What’s more destructive to the park land....a flying camera at 50’ or greater, dirt bike, snowmobile, or off road truck?

 

[sar104]

How about common sense, as related to this argument. What’s more destructive to the park land....a flying camera at 50’ or greater, dirt bike, snowmobile, or off road truck?

His argument wasn't about common sense - it was about his "rights".

 

[scoble08]

His argument wasn't about common sense - it was about his "rights".

I see. Can you answer my question?

 

[sar104]

I see. Can you answer my question?

I assumed your question was rhetorical. In most situations the dirt bikes, snowmobiles and trucks will be far more destructive. That doesn't, however, mean that UAVs are not a problem. NPS identified several issues: disturbance of wildlife, noise nuisance, and public safety at tourist hot spots if, as expected, UAVs became the new selfie stick for tourists. All of those are legitimate concerns. I'd like to see NPS implement permits for limited sUAS operations but right now there is no way that they have the resources or staff to do that effectively and so, unfortunately, they have taken the simpler approach of a complete ban. I think that will change eventually.

 

[scoble08]

I assumed your question was rhetorical. In most situations the dirt bikes, snowmobiles and trucks will be far more destructive. That doesn't, however, mean that UAVs are not a problem. NPS identified several issues: disturbance of wildlife, noise nuisance, and public safety at tourist hot spots if, as expected, UAVs became the new selfie stick for tourists. All of those are legitimate concerns. I'd like to see NPS implement permits for limited sUAS operations but right now there is no way that they have the resources or staff to do that effectively and so, unfortunately, they have taken the simpler approach of a complete ban. I think that will change eventually.

Excellent! My sentiments exactly! I would just like to have the ability (within shared consideration) to photograph/share the beauty of our fantastic NP’s.

 

[sar104]

Excellent! My sentiments exactly! I would just like to have the ability (within shared consideration) to photograph/share the beauty of our fantastic NP’s.

Completely agree. There are numerous locations here that I would really like to photograph, and I'd be happy to pay for a permit with restrictions. NPS has limited funding and bigger problems to worry about, unfortunately.

 

[Drgnfli]

So what's your solution - unrestricted use of those lands? You want to fly your drone there. Others want to ride their dirt bikes and snowmobiles, or take their trucks offroading. What about their rights? You good with all of that, or just your drone?

JHCripes! My drone flying would consist of about 30 minutes using 2 batts, maybe, in one area flying at least 100' high. Then I would move on to another area miles away to fly another 15 to 30 minutes taking more videos. While I was doing that the dirt bikes & snowmobiles & offroad trucks would be tearing up the quiet forest making deafening noises for as long as THEIR GAS TANKS WOULD LAST (hours & hours)! How in the world is that a close comparison or equal in any way?

 

[Drgnfli]

What's the rules in the GSMNP (great smoky mountain national park)?

You cannot target shoot or fire your gun in those parks unless it is to protect yourself from man or beast!