High Visibility Vests

[Torque]

We often joke about the value of high visiblity "Drone Pilot" vests and after a discussion with some flying buddies the other day, one of them sent me this FAA notice. Dated 2018, I thought it was interesting and I couldn't find where it had been shared here:

https://www.faa.gov/sites/faa.gov/files/other_visit/aviation_industry/airline_operators/airline_safety/InFO18001.pdf

 

[GFields]

I always wear one. I discovered years ago the more "professional" you look, the fewer questions will be asked.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[mavic3usa]

It's 50/50 that I would wear one. I switched to visibility orange when I started flying Autel quite a bit and I added the FAA patches with the appropriate language outlined in the bulletin. I also added a patch that said "Droning is not a crime" or something to that effect. Granted this is less effective when you are FPV with goggles and have a bunch of drone equipment laying around.

It's been pretty hot lately so I only wear T-shirt and it's one from here: T-Shirts | Alien Drones

A city park official actually came up to me laughing and said "Do you think wearing that t-shirt makes you thinking no one is going to approach you and ask you what you are doing?" No joke. Even though this was highly inappropriate way to confront someone, I simply said "No" and went about my business. Everybody is a "detective" these days and seen too many movies about deception and see themselves as not falling for it.

 

[MS Coast]

It's 50/50 that I would wear one. I switched to visibility orange when I started flying Autel quite a bit and I added the FAA patches with the appropriate language outlined in the bulletin. I also added a patch that said "Droning is not a crime" or something to that effect. Granted this is less effective when you are FPV with goggles and have a bunch of drone equipment laying around.

It's been pretty hot lately so I only wear T-shirt and it's one from here: T-Shirts | Alien Drones

A city park official actually came up to me laughing and said "Do you think wearing that t-shirt makes you thinking no one is going to approach you and ask you what you are doing?" No joke. Even though this was highly inappropriate way to confront someone, I simply said "No" and went about my business. Everybody is a "detective" these days and seen too many movies about deception and see themselves as not falling for it.

Or maybe he was simply being friendly and humorous rather than confrontational. No joke.

Since you don't describe any further interaction, I'm guessing that was the case.

 

[mavic3usa]

Or maybe he was simply being friendly and humorous rather than confrontational. No joke.

Since you don't describe any further interaction, I'm guessing that was the case.

Yeah I didn't go into further because I don't like confrontation and he was nice but passive aggressive. But I'll tell you the highlights:

He said we really don't allow drones to fly around this area, this is consider city property and we are a government agency. I said Oh really is that a law or a city ordinance? He said, I don't know. Just when the kids are playing and we have games going on....and I interrupted with Sure, I don't fly here when there is organized play, people wouldn't appreciate it, I understand. And then he left with an OK. I think when he saw that I wasn't going there, he rolled back and broke it off. I was not mean but yes, short.

There has to be two dozen soccer fields and baseballs diamonds for kids of all ages and particularly on game day when everything is full, there must be thousands of people and the parking lots are so full they park on the grass. That day, there were zero people on any of the half-dozen fields in sight when I park in the empty parking lot, one rogue kid in the skateboard park....around mid-day lunch time. Literally impossible to fly a drone without flying over players and spectators and you'd have to be crazy to fly thru the tunnels and pathways and behind the cages and thru the scoreboards with an FPV during a game or practice. However, it is much fun when it's totally empty. Been doing it for years in this complex.

Bugs me that he would start the approach that way but that's fine as long as he didn't start with "what are you doing here" or lead into "it's illegal...." There is absolutely no way I'm going to stop flying here, it is across the street from where I live, I hate to fly from home near and over and around my neighbors residences and I can use a backpack and my e-bike to get there in 5 minutes and cross 1 major street at the light and if it's not game day, it's mostly empty and deserted. The police have driven by and seen me and didn't stop and I made a public records request to the city years ago and they told me there are no laws against drones after I read the entire code for myself and saw none.

Criticism and critique welcome.

 

[Torque]

There is absolutely no way I'm going to stop flying here, it is across the street from where I live, I hate to fly from home near and over and around my neighbors residences and I can use a backpack and my e-bike to get there in 5 minutes and cross 1 major street at the light and if it's not game day, it's mostly empty and deserted. The police have driven by and seen me and didn't stop and I made a public records request to the city years ago and they told me there are no laws against drones after I read the entire code for myself and saw none.

Sounds like the cop was on patrol, attempted to make small talk with a community member and was rebuffed.


He didn't tell you not to fly there (unless there was a game). Why would you even consider not flying there? Certainly not as the result of this benign interaction?

 

[mavic3usa]

Sounds like the cop was on patrol, attempted to make small talk with a community member and was rebuffed.


He didn't tell you not to fly there (unless it there was a game). Why would you even consider not flying there? Certainly not as the result of this benign interaction?

He wasn't cop, we don't have cop patrols like that; he was a city employee in his POV. His approach was a bit off but since he was laughing about my shirt....these words bothered me the most:

"We don't allow drones to fly here"
"The [sports complex] is considered city government property."

If I had not pushed back, he would have ended up asking me to leave; no doubt in my mind. At the time I got the impression he thought I was trying to fly there and avoid anyone from approaching me by wearing "the shirt."

Yes, he was rebuffed; for sure. Bet he won't drive up on me again like that on my own property talking nonsense.

For sure, most people who work in the park know who I am by now. My car and personalized license plate is recognizable and I sit in my chair for FPV right in front of my car when I park in the parking lot.

 

[MS Coast]

His approach was a bit off but since he was laughing about my shirt...

The humor about the shirt seems to be a big issue.

If I had not pushed back, he would have ended up asking me to leave; no doubt in my mind. At the time I got the impression he thought I was trying to fly there and avoid anyone from approaching me by wearing "the shirt."

Conjecture. You're reacting to something that he didn't do.

Yes, he was rebuffed; for sure. Bet he won't drive up on me again like that on my own property talking nonsense.

No, he probably won't speak to you at all.

Consider the other side:

"Yeah, boss, there was a guy flying drone a drone and I went over to let him know the park is city property and that people aren't supposed to fly there when there are kids playing. I made a little joke about his official drone pilot shirt when I walked up and it seemed to really offend him. He just ignored me. Then when I tried to explain what you told me about drones in the park, he interrupted and got a little short with me. I just gave up, said "OK" and left."

"Thanks, Bob. I'll tell the rest of the staff to keep an eye out for that guy. If you see him, or anyone else, flying close to the kids, call me right away."

 

[mavic3usa]

The humor about the shirt seems to be a big issue.

Conjecture. You're reacting to something that he didn't do.

No, he probably won't speak to you at all.

Consider the other side:

"Yeah, boss, there was a guy flying drone a drone and I went over to let him know the park is city property and that people aren't supposed to fly there when there are kids playing. I made a little joke about his official drone pilot shirt when I walked up and it seemed to really offend him. He just ignored me. Then when I tried to explain what you told me about drones in the park, he interrupted and got a little short with me. I just gave up, said "OK" and left."

"Thanks, Bob. I'll tell the rest of the staff to keep an eye out for that guy. If you see him, or anyone else, flying close to the kids, call me right away."

Or, they can mind their own business like all the other workers and employees who have seen me for years and years and have said nothing. They've never had a complaint about anyone flying drones during the tournaments or even at the organized practices, not something I would ever do. Therefore they have no reason to send out an employee to talk to me about it. I'm almost positive he came over on his own but now that you mention it, perhaps I should put in a public records request to find out how many complaints they have received.

He should have not even bothered with me because you are right, I'm not very approachable and when I'm flying FPV, it's not cool to interrupt. If you want to come over to me when the public is present (which you will never find me there because when I see activity, I turn around and come home), fine. It's almost impossible to fly FPV up and down pathways and in and around scoreboards and thru nets and backstops and 6 inches off the soccer field lines when people are around. When nobody is in the park, stay away please. Don't come over to me at 1pm and tell me I have until 5pm when the games start for the day (pretty sure he would have went there before I cut him off).

You forget the part about when he said you can't fly a drone here, I asked him if it was a law or an ordinance. At that point, his attitude changed meaning he saw I was serious. He went from joking to not so joking but looking for a way to respond. He said he didn't know or wasn't sure about the law but when he started to give me directions....I don't need directions from a city worker in a city park.

So yes, those two things are on me: When he approached me with joking, I wasn't in the mood for that kind of introduction and leading question and when I asked him about the law, his response to try to start giving me directions and yes, I cut him off. That one is on me, for sure. Nobody in this city knows more about how to fly drones around the public then me so I don't need what I thought was a lecture coming from him. He was right to say have a good day and leave before it went any further; he got the message.

And if they want to keep an eye on me, that's fine. There are cameras all over the area, I'm sure they know every single time I have entered the property and they know I have been flying there for years. You cannot miss me, I have worn a vest and I wear clothing in which I can be seen, I'm not trying to hide. Where I park, it's right in front of a camera on the pole. My FPV is all over that camera feed.

 

[Torque]

Nobody in this city knows more about how to fly drones around the public then me so I don't need what I thought was a lecture coming from him.

He probably felt bad for not recognizing you right off the bat! And awkwardly tried to back away after realizing exactly WHO he was talking to.

 

[MS Coast]

Where was your visual observer while you were flying FPV with goggles?

Maybe that park employee didn't see him or her and thought you didn't have one.

 

[mavic3usa]

Where was your visual observer while you were flying FPV with goggles?

Maybe that park employee didn't see him or her and thought you didn't have one.

The park employee doesn't get to approach me and ask any questions and expect an answer which again, is where I expected the conversation to go. My reply would have been "I don't answer questions."

Exactly why it's not a good idea to approach me. General public is fine but think twice in your official capacity. Flying a drone is not a crime and if I get that vibe from you....

If you would like to have that discussion about a VO, perhaps we can revisit the numerous threads already on the topic, I'm happy to address it there.

 

[Torque]

The park employee doesn't get to approach me and ask any questions and expect an answer which again, is where I expected the conversation to go. My reply would have been "I don't answer questions."

Exactly why it's not a good idea to approach me. General public is fine but think twice in your official capacity. Flying a drone is not a crime and if I get that vibe from you....

If you would like to have that discussion about a VO, perhaps we can revisit the numerous threads already on the topic, I'm happy to address it there.

Does your VO also identify the people approaching you so you know whether it is an official or Joe Public?
Otherwise you'd have to lower your goggles and make a quick assesment before responding?

 

[mavic3usa]

Does your VO also identify the people approaching you so you know whether it is an official or Joe Public?
Otherwise you'd have to lower your goggles and make a quick assesment before responding?

I actually saw him with drone while I was in the process of coming home and landing so everything happened quickly. He didn't have to interrupt my flight and I didn't have to do anything differently with my goggles. I recognized him as a city employee from his hat. During the day in an empty parking lot, there is almost zero chance joe public will pull up on you so I quickly knew who I was dealing with. Have since seen his truck in the employee parking lot so I'm convinced.

 

[MS Coast]

• So, habitually flying FPV with goggles and without a visual observer in a public park where children frequently play.
• Getting upset because a park employee didn't realize that the rules for approaching you were different depending on whether he was acting as a member of the general public or as a park employee.
• As for "I don't answer questions." while flying a registered drone, a look here might avoid some future complications in encounters with law enforcement officers. (I do realize your tormentor was not a LEO and that your FPV drone may not require registration.)
  
  

  How to Register Your Drone | Federal Aviation Administration

  Register your drone at FAA DroneZone either under part 107 or the Exception for Recreational Flyers. If you are not sure what kind of a drone flyer you are, check out our User Identification Tool or visit our Getting Started webpage to learn more.

  www.faa.gov
  
  Excerpt: "Federal law requires pilots flying drones that require registration, to show their certificate of registration to any Federal, State, or local law enforcement officer if asked."

Thanks, but no need to revisit FPV VO requirements; that's straightforward.

 

[mavic3usa]

• So, habitually flying FPV with goggles and without a visual observer in a public park where children frequently play.
• Getting upset because a park employee didn't realize that the rules for approaching you were different depending on whether he was acting as a member of the general public or as a park employee.
• As for "I don't answer questions." while flying a registered drone, a look here might avoid some future complications in encounters with law enforcement officers. (I do realize your tormentor was not a LEO and that your FPV drone may not require registration.)
  
  

  How to Register Your Drone | Federal Aviation Administration

  Register your drone at FAA DroneZone either under part 107 or the Exception for Recreational Flyers. If you are not sure what kind of a drone flyer you are, check out our User Identification Tool or visit our Getting Started webpage to learn more.

  www.faa.gov
  
  Excerpt: "Federal law requires pilots flying drones that require registration, to show their certificate of registration to any Federal, State, or local law enforcement officer if asked."

Thanks, but no need to revisit FPV VO requirements; that's straightforward.

Nobody there. Doesn't matter if people go there later in the week, last month, or some other time. Better to approach me then, not today.

I didn't get upset. He's allowed to approach. But if you're going to approach, just beware what you lead off with. He was acting as a park employee, for sure.

I don't answer questions. That's my right.

 

[MARK (LI)]

So...after being treated so nicely by a drone operator the City Employee goes to boss and says something like this....I encountered someone flying a drone today..and he was a little bit nasty, but he brought up an interesting point...the guy asked me if there is a law about drones...so the boss responds and says something like....we better discuss this with the City council and get them to put something in writing...so City Council looks into it, finds out you were flying in violation of VO reg, were nasty to a guy doing his job and they decide to ban drones outright...and put up signs like this

You are a great ambassador of good will for the hobby ...thanks for your efforts to maintain a low but positive profile

 

[Dbez1]

I always wear one. I discovered years ago the more "professional" you look, the fewer questions will be asked.

Thanks for sharing.

I couldn’t agree more. The more “official” we look, the less likely we are to be approached by anti drone enthusiasts, especially when in a very public environment.

 

[jambros3]

We often joke about the value of high visiblity "Drone Pilot" vests and after a discussion with some flying buddies the other day, one of them sent me this FAA notice. Dated 2018, I thought it was interesting and I couldn't find where it had been shared here:

https://www.faa.gov/sites/faa.gov/files/other_visit/aviation_industry/airline_operators/airline_safety/InFO18001.pdf

Thank you for providing this document. I have a vest ordered on the way and was thinking about exactly the same thing. Going forward I will have more confidence wearing it.

 

[Geobeck7]

I couldn’t agree more. The more “official” we look, the less likely we are to be approached by anti drone enthusiasts, especially when in a very public environment.

Much agreed there’s always a Drone commando somewhere lurking in the bushes.