Learning spatial perspective in the distance??

[SCK]

How do you practice flying with the screen view (IE no peripheral view). I was flying the other day trying to get a feel for flying while watching the video feed. I was only 60’ up and maybe 100’ away so I was trying to fly near and around some trees. In the view the tree appeared much closer than the drone actually was (good thing for safety). I was close enough that I had a good perspective on where the drone was but it makes me nervous about flying in the distance where you lose the spatial perspective. For example, I live just off a golf course and I would like to fly from my house to one of the fairways which are tree lined and fly down the fairway at a height lower than the trees. This time of year I can see the drone fine but I lose perspective on how far it actually is from the trees. I know I can always go up to clear the trees without a problem but not having that actual spatial perspective make me really nervous about where the drone is in relation to the things around it (all directions). A video from 300 to 400’ is not always the view you want. I would like to fly to the course (300yrds away) be sure I have cleared the trees then drop down and fly the fairway then return. I currently cant do this without stopping the M2Z and checking where it is by rotating 360 degrees often which does not make for great video....

I see videos of people flying around objects in the distance (cliffs, waterfalls, buildings, ….) so I know it can be “learned” just not sure what the best way to learn it is (without crashing)

 

[Deleted member 79533]

How do you practice flying with the screen view (IE no peripheral view). I was flying the other day trying to get a feel for flying while watching the video feed. I was only 60’ up and maybe 100’ away so I was trying to fly near and around some trees. In the view the tree appeared much closer than the drone actually was (good thing for safety). I was close enough that I had a good perspective on where the drone was but it makes me nervous about flying in the distance where you lose the spatial perspective. For example, I live just off a golf course and I would like to fly from my house to one of the fairways which are tree lined and fly down the fairway at a height lower than the trees. This time of year I can see the drone fine but I lose perspective on how far it actually is from the trees. I know I can always go up to clear the trees without a problem but not having that actual spatial perspective make me really nervous about where the drone is in relation to the things around it (all directions). A video from 300 to 400’ is not always the view you want. I would like to fly to the course (300yrds away) be sure I have cleared the trees then drop down and fly the fairway then return. I currently cant do this without stopping the M2Z and checking where it is by rotating 360 degrees often which does not make for great video....

I see videos of people flying around objects in the distance (cliffs, waterfalls, buildings, ….) so I know it can be “learned” just not sure what the best way to learn it is (without crashing)

When I first started flying serious (dji) drones, I had the same concern. I practiced with the drone in tripod mode flying between closely spaced Leyland Cypress (sp?) trees. The branches are very soft and since the distance to ground is not that much, I replaced a few props and learned a bit. Still hit things from time to time. YMMV

 

[FoxhallGH]

Practice where you have visual line of sight (VLOS) so you have both views and that will allow you to get the feel of what you are doing .... Must say though, you are describing flying your drone outside of (beyond) VLOS which is frowned upon if not illegal in most countries!

 

[SCK]

Practice where you have visual line of sight (VLOS) so you have both views and that will allow you to get the feel of what you are doing .... Must say though, you are describing flying your drone outside of (beyond) VLOS which is frowned upon if not illegal in most countries!

it is winter (even in the south) the trees are sparse have NO cover. I can see right through them to the drone so I DO have VLOS. Not to get off topic but I like this site (a lot of really helpful people) but the "rules police" are really annoying. they ASSUME everyone is breaking the rules and that they know better than everyone. I ran a forum on a different subject and solved the issue you forcing users to use their real name instead of an internet handle. still had to ban a few internet jerks. Just tired of every thread being commented on by the BA Internet Drone Police who think they need to "correct" everyone OFF SOAPBOX

rp6 thanks! glad to know I am not the only one with concerns about distance flying and trying to learn..

 

[FormerMember07122019_2]

Hi SCK,

I have the same problem. When you are flying a few hundred feet away with VLOS is is very difficult to know if you are 10 ft or 30 ft from a tree. It’s even harder at low elevations due to lack of perspective. I constantly check between the screen and the actual drone and I assume over time I will get calibrated so my perception precision will improve.

By the way, if you do “look around” by rotating you can always edit that part out of your movie.

Ken

 

[FoxhallGH]

it is winter (even in the south) the trees are sparse have NO cover. I can see right through them to the drone so I DO have VLOS. Not to get off topic but I like this site (a lot of really helpful people) but the "rules police" are really annoying. they ASSUME everyone is breaking the rules and that they know better than everyone. I ran a forum on a different subject and solved the issue you forcing users to use their real name instead of an internet handle. still had to ban a few internet jerks. Just tired of every thread being commented on by the BA Internet Drone Police who think they need to "correct" everyone OFF SOAPBOX

rp6 thanks! glad to know I am not the only one with concerns about distance flying and trying to learn..

Just saying buddy ... 300 yards away and below the tree-line does sound a little BVLOS. Sorry if I'm sounding a bit evangelistic - but we have a bunch of drone flying idiots in the UK f*****g it up for all of us. I did lead with the advice please note ... Have fun and don't hit a tree.

 

[Mossiback]

We are assuming that there are no golfers using the course at the time you are doing this. That could be a big assumption, since most golfers I know are a bit nuts for the game (in Seattle you can see them golfing in the rain). Also, I would not be surprised if there are a lot of lawyer golfers that would be more than happy to sue you if something went wrong.

Having said that, if you fly forward only and keep to the center of the fairway, you should not have a problem. Most accidents happen with trees when someone tries panning sideways making it impossible to see the branches they fly into. Also be aware that since the trees have no cover OA may not detect a small branch in time to stop (if at all).

It would be best to be standing close to the tee for each hole and record one hole at a time.

 

[SCK]

still off subject but the course is closed on Mondays so I do not have to worry about golfers. the situation was a hypothetical training idea to learn to fly remotely. FoxhallGH you do sound preachy as you DONT know the detail so the hypothetical "flight" The course is closed, the trees are sparse and have no leaf cover, I can see the drone at 900' (even with my old eyes). Instead of trying to look for what I am doing "wrong" so you can blow your internet police whistle, why not just provide some helpful advice on how to learn in terms of the question asked.

The question is how do you learn to fly spatially when remote (I don't thin 900' is that far for most people around here)

I appreciate those who provided helpful tips and comments as that is what I need to learn.

 

[FoxhallGH]

FoxhallGH you do sound preachy as you DONT know the detail so the hypothetical "flight" The course is closed, the trees are sparse and have no leaf cover, I can see the drone at 900' (even with my old eyes). Instead of trying to look for what I am doing "wrong" so you can blow your internet police whistle, why not just provide some helpful advice on how to learn in terms of the question asked.

With what's happening to our hobby / profession at the moment - Yes - I will take an opportunity to point-out that you MAY be getting into a grey area! Of course I didn't know the detail of the flight, past what you have described ... How can I? ... I did offer advice first however, as I have done the same thing slaloming through young willow trees near our local river - again I offer the same advice as offered in my post #3 above, that I found it easiest to learn to do this when I could see both the drone, and the trees I was navigating through ... In other words, start close where you don't have to rely JUST on FPV on the Go 4 display. Another hint is - line up the tree with something directly behind it when you are travelling directly toward the tree, then slide right or left, until you can see what was hidden ... Since your course remains the same, you will miss the tree.

I apologise for making an assumption, but it was based on the information given in your OP, and I did say that "you were describing ... "

Instead of getting all defensive and critical about someone trying to maintain the reputation of your hobby, just refine your explanation as to what you are doing - and I'll happily defend your right to do it! I'd hope that you'd be equally critical of me if I suggested doing something that to you 'appeared' to be against the rules.

 

[SCK]

FoxhallGH, sorry I jumped but it is just one of my pet peeves. I honestly think the only bad thing about this forum is the number of posts where someone asks a question or has an issue and it becomes 6+ pages of people thumping their rulebook at them instead of answering the question. I end up closing 10 - 20% of the threads because of the 107 and BVLOS off topic comments that I am learning nothing from. I get that there are people doing stupid things with drones and it is causing regulation issues. However, there is a group here that assumes every flight except their own is done wrong and they don’t answer questions, they just troll for threads they can “correct” on. [off soapbox]


Thanks for the helpful tip on aligning objects as that is what I was looking for. I am still not comfortable flying by looking at the screen but at a distance there is no depth perception or peripheral view, so I am trying to figure out how to navigate using the screen only. My practice area is about half the size of a football field (American Football) with 30 or so sparsely placed hardwoods. I am trying to fly through it while just watching the screen but can’t force myself to not look up. Looking up is fine when I am nearby but it is not an option in the distance (reason for practice). I don’t plan on flying through trees in the distance, but I figure if I can do it close by, it will help me navigate in the distance. My max distance so far is 2700’ in an open field so I could still see the drone but I had no feeling for how far it was from objects (trees at other end of the field) looking at the map when I was done, showed me that I was a lot further away from the end of the field than I thought I was and the video playback confirmed it (ie the video sucked because the drone was not where I thought it was). This is also why I want to fly the fairway of the golf course at a distance, it fairly open once in/over it and is still close enough that I can see the drone even if I can’t tell exactly where it is in relation to things around it (pushing my comfort zone).

again, sorry I jumped on your comment and thanks for the tip. I'm trying to figure out this expensive toy without having to post a "I crashed my drone today" thread.

 

[FoxhallGH]

No problems @SCK ... I got a useful tip on a video that was about flying under structures - like bridges ... It was that if you could see both edges - front and back - of the e.g. bridge, then you know that you are going to be passing under it. If you can only see the closest edge, you know that you are going to hit it! That's what I applied to flying around trees and what I meant in my #9 comment above. Something else that I've found useful, is using the 'Course Lock' mode (but I don't think the M2P has that yet?). It's a mode where you set a course that the Mavic will fly forward or backward along, depending on if you push the controller stick forward or back - and no matter what way the drone is pointing! Even if the Mavic is facing you, when you push the stick away, it goes away. This mode is great, because you can set up on the fairway, point the drone at where you want to end up, and even if you pan left and right (or even spin right round) while you drift down that line, you stay on that track (like a dolly-camera shot on rails), and continue on course at a constant speed. It allows you to 'see' a clear track, and know that no matter how much looking around you do, you'll still be on that track.

 

[Kilrah]

Practice, lots of practice.

be sure I have cleared the trees then drop down

It may be hard to judge where you are when "far" away but it's typically pretty obvious when you've passed an object.

Keep the zoom on wide until you get used to that, zooming in makes it harder...

 

[SCK]

sounds like one of the quickshot modes (cant remember the name) except I think it flys to the point automaticly and you can turn the POV. that said, i have not played with those yet.... other than the track mode

 

[Lubar]

I fly in a mountain area with many ridges and valleys. Very easy to be maintaining altitude and run in valley walls. I rely on obstacle sensors to warn me if obstacle is coming up. Once I get close to slope I slow down. Maybe trusting sensors is a bad idea. Correct me if I am wrong. After awhile you start being able to judge position easier.

 

[FoxhallGH]

I fly in a mountain area with many ridges and valleys. Very easy to be maintaining altitude and run in valley walls. I rely on obstacle sensors to warn me if obstacle is coming up. Once I get close to slope I slow down. Maybe trusting sensors is a bad idea. Correct me if I am wrong. After awhile you start being able to judge position easier.

It's exactly like learning to see with one eye. We have stereoscopic vision so that we can judge distance, but when you have a single eye/camera - then the only way you have to work out distance, is to judge how big something is, and the rate that it's changing in size as you move toward it ... that's a whole new ball-game.

 

[Kilrah]

Nice one, never thought of this comparison but it's very appropriate.
I wonder if closing an eye and training to judge distances with only one would help.

 

[DanMan32]

sounds like one of the quickshot modes (cant remember the name) except I think it flys to the point automaticly and you can turn the POV. that said, i have not played with those yet.... other than the track mode

That may be waypoint or tapfly.
Waypoint is programming an autonomous flight. On M2 not available in Go except hyperlapse, but available in Litchi.
Tapfly you point where you want it to go and it goes there. You can't yaw with it though to look around and not change course. You also have to watch your horizon as it will change course in altitude as well as horizontal based on where you select to go.

One means of perspective I've learned is use your horizon if your terrain is flat enough. If an approaching object is below your horizon, you will clear it.

 

[SCK]

Nice one, never thought of this comparison but it's very appropriate.
I wonder if closing an eye and training to judge distances with only one would help.

I'd most likely walk into a tree. Of course I am way out of warranty and any damage most likely would not be worth fixing.... The M2Z is a different story, it is new and has multiple coverage options (DJI and SF)

 

[Point Zero]

Your not the only one who is kind of sick of hearing from the drone police. It’s just a sad fact of modern day life that many people still actually believe what the news tells them. We have peeps crawling out of the woodwork to tell others to be safe and be legal like thousands of people have been killed by hobbyist drones! Weirdly enough tens of thousands have been killed by military drones but I never hear one of these police types mention that! Nobody has been killed or seriously injured because of a hobby drone. Sorry to the OP for this little rant

 

[FormerMember07122019_2]

It's exactly like learning to see with one eye. We have stereoscopic vision so that we can judge distance, but when you have a single eye/camera - then the only way you have to work out distance, is to judge how big something is, and the rate that it's changing in size as you move toward it ... that's a whole new ball-game.

Great observation, It just made me realize that nature has the same solution. Animals that have eyes on the sides of their heads, like birds, do not have depth perception and use a technique of bobbing their head front to back to gain this depth perception. I guess you could go forward and back quickly to help judge the distance.