Mavic Pro-2 vs Zoom and P4P - Line Skipping + Sensor Heat?

[Cliff_622]

DJI:
"Raw subsampling is different from line skipping; it uses the full area (of the 16:9 portion) of the image sensor so the signal-noise-ratio is much better than line skipping. Raw subsampling is also different from pixel binning. It is an optimized filtering & sampling process which is much more advanced than the simple average mechanism of pixel binning. Raw subsampling causes some loss in the finest details. However, this is not as visible in real scenes (like aerial filming) as it is on charts."

Raw sub-sampling IS exactly what pixel binning is. They are saying theirs is better in simple pixel binning yet the end results are identical.

Funny....

"The FOV mode looks fantastic with a bit of post. Nobody will see an issue when its transcoded out into a final clip. " This could be very TRUE for you and I dont dispute your opinion. I have also had MANY people say that 1080 Spark footage is spectacular and all they will ever need. Again, I say that is awesome for "them" too!

How can I say their opinion is "wrong"?? The Spark looks very nice too. It's just not good for "me"...that's all.

CT

 

[sar104]

DJI:
"Raw subsampling is different from line skipping; it uses the full area (of the 16:9 portion) of the image sensor so the signal-noise-ratio is much better than line skipping. Raw subsampling is also different from pixel binning. It is an optimized filtering & sampling process which is much more advanced than the simple average mechanism of pixel binning. Raw subsampling causes some loss in the finest details. However, this is not as visible in real scenes (like aerial filming) as it is on charts."

Raw sub-sampling IS exactly what pixel binning is. They are saying theirs is better in simple pixel binning yet the end results are identical.

Funny....

Depending on exactly what they are doing, raw sub-sampling is possibly different. In terms of simple definition it could be worse (reading only every nth sensor site) or it could be the same (reading them all but averaging before reading out from the chip), or it could involve something cleverer on the chip such as reading all and applying an additional digital low-pass filter before reading out the sub-sampled data.

 

[Cliff_622]

Depending on exactly what they are doing, raw sub-sampling is possibly different. In terms of simple definition it could be worse (reading only every nth sensor site) or it could be the same (reading them all but averaging before reading out from the chip), or it could involve something cleverer on the chip such as reading all and applying an additional digital low-pass filter before reading out the sub-sampled data.

Certainly. The ironic part is that it yields nothing better than plain, old fashioned, run of the mill, simple pixel binning that has bin around forever. (or line skipping) lol

Big question is: "Why" was it required? For what reason?

CT

 

[WithTheBirds]

DJI:
"Raw subsampling is different from line skipping; it uses the full area (of the 16:9 portion) of the image sensor so the signal-noise-ratio is much better than line skipping. Raw subsampling is also different from pixel binning. It is an optimized filtering & sampling process which is much more advanced than the simple average mechanism of pixel binning. Raw subsampling causes some loss in the finest details. However, this is not as visible in real scenes (like aerial filming) as it is on charts."

Raw sub-sampling IS exactly what pixel binning is. They are saying theirs is better in simple pixel binning yet the end results are identical.

Funny....

"The FOV mode looks fantastic with a bit of post. Nobody will see an issue when its transcoded out into a final clip. " This could be very TRUE for you and I dont dispute your opinion. I have also had MANY people say that 1080 Spark footage is spectacular and all they will ever need. Again, I say that is awesome for "them" too!

How can I say their opinion is "wrong"?? The Spark looks very nice too. It's just not good for "me"...that's all.

CT

Accepted and understood, no issue- we all have different requirements. I have good friends who build their RC models and use them as display items. I like flying mine. There are many aspects to every hobby and pursuit. I wonder if you might share what you think should have been done to provide a FOV mode you would consider acceptable?

My understanding of DJi’s Explanation is they are taking the full readout from the Sony sensor and applying the “raw sub sampling” on the SOC (not employing any of the Sony line addition modes in the sensor feature set).

 

[sar104]

Certainly. The ironic part is that it yields nothing better than plain, old fashioned, run of the mill, simple pixel binning that has bin around forever. (or line skipping) lol

Big question is: "Why" was it required? For what reason?

CT

Well pixel binning is obviously better than line skipping because it throws away fewer data. And sub-sampling, if it is really sub-readout as implied, could in theory be better than either, depending on the level of processing on the chip. As for why they did it - I think that DJI answered that one, at least by strong implication - the image processor is not able to handle 20 MP readout at 30 fps.

 

[igor88]

It could have been such a good drone.

 

[Lon Denard]

the text "Hasselblad" written on front, in big font

That's your first post on the Mavic 2 Pro forum? Hahaha!

 

[Lon Denard]

It could have been such a good drone.

What's the deal with people joining the forum just to trash the Mavic 2 Pro?

 

[Lon Denard]

While you all are discussing...

 

[igor88]

What's the deal with people joining the forum just to trash the Mavic 2 Pro?

you got a point. signing out

 

[Pizdous]

While you all are discussing...

****! Love you're video! awesome work!

 

[Lon Denard]

****! Love you're video! awesome work!

Thanks Connor! I didn't make this video, this guy is a technician with the Mavic 2 Pro.

 

[Hiflyer808]

Filmmaker Philip Bloom: mp2 great image quality even in full fov mode. Thorough tester Max Yureyev: mp2 lousy quality for the money, returning it. And now, Drone School guy, who's all about cimematic, high quality video: mp2 is great and full fov mode is slightly BETTER than hq mode.
Two things they all seem to agee on: you have to use h265 and dlog corrected in post to get optimal results, and, the "softer" image as compared to the p4p is at least partly intentional, with less sharpening applied in-camera. If you don't want to do a fair amount of editing, don't get this drone.

 

[Lon Denard]

Filmmaker Philip Bloom: mp2 great image quality even in full fov mode. Thorough tester Max Yureyev: mp2 lousy quality for the money, returning it. And now, Drone School guy, who's all about cimematic, high quality video: mp2 is great and full fov mode is slightly BETTER than hq mode.
Two things they all seem to agee on: you have to use h265 and dlog corrected in post to get optimal results, and, the "softer" image as compared to the p4p is at least partly intentional, with less sharpening applied in-camera. If you don't want to do a fair amount of editing, don't get this drone.

Or...fly in normal and HQ and forget about this nonsense.

 

[Hiflyer808]

Or...fly in normal and HQ and forget about this nonsense.

Not if you want good dynamic range..

 

[FiShBuRn]

He must be rather blind, not seeing a detail difference between f2.8 and f11, nor FOV vs HQ...

He showed atual footage with some scale and you cant see to much of a difference (i know its there but...)...anyway like he says the drone its just one part of the story....its better to fly then count pixels with the drone on the ground!

 

[mattball]

Most of the case


LoL these your local RC club heroes are noobs who don't know how to apply lens correction in post which takes 10 seconds stick with your Chinese clone drones!

They are not the only noobs with the lens issue. Quite a bunch that don't want to have to fix the issue in post even if it took 1 second. 2 Of them bought Evo's after returning the MP2. The other is undecided and may just get a used Inspire. Evo does great with 4K 60 fps. I think that is what others wanted anyway and were disappointed MP2 was limited to 30 fps. Those noobs can't fix that in post either.

 

[FiShBuRn]

They are happy because noone shows charts of Evo in 4K60 because if that shows up the story would be different...Like everyone talks about that P4P does 4K60 but when P4P was released we saw a bunch of people talking about pixel-binning in this mode at the quality was much lower than 4K30.

 

[mattball]

P4P is better value at this price point with better quality images compared to the M2P. Plus the P4P has no lens distortion whatsoever.

It almost infuriates me that DJI are celebrating a distorted Hasselblad lens with less than true 4k resolution video at this price point !!! Granted, it's very portable and it's harder to crash, plus a little more battery life.

Log is useless due to distortion, HLG has too much noise in the darker shadows and is therefore useless. H.265 is useless for most people due to hardware demands. Finally the overall depth of the 'high' dynamic range isn't remarkable (sensor?).

You get the picture, the negatives are really stacking up! You can see why a lot of people are upset with the marketing hype.

You can fix all that in post!!!!

So many make excuses for DJI, just like so many that made excuses for Apple. "They'll fix that in the next round"... Stand in line and spend more $$$

No thanks. DJI makes good stuff, but to me MP2 is way over hyped. I likes some of the shots, but Evo looks great too. I'll be awaiting the P5 as well.

 

[pa2x]

Hi folks,

After reading all this huge topic I must say that every drone model is in it’s own category. Phantom 4 has the same sensor size as mavic pro but video & photos are way much better with Phantom! Now, Phantom 4 Pro has again the same sensor size as Mavic Pro 2 and still there is much difference in quality!! I mean, this is logical and that’s why DJI keeps the prices high especially after the release of Phantom 4 Pro V2.0. The Phantom 4 Pro V1.0 is already at a better price! After the release of Phantom 5 the difference in picture quality will be huge!!