Problems/dislike people have with drones

[bmcelya]

In this instance (and most Gov parks) they are NOT attempting to control Airspace at all. It's a Land Use situation and they worded it very clearly to demonstrate that with:

"No person shall launch, land, or operate a powered unmanned aircraft or Unmanned Aerial System (UAS) within Anza-Borrego Desert State Park."

I believe they *are* attempting to govern airspace. They are prohibiting operations inside the park even though the mission may have originated outside the park, and it should be made more clear in their placards that drones are not allowed, no matter where they take off. That is my point about them attempting to control airspace. Do I have the right to transit the park on my way somewhere else? An airplane does. Do airplanes offer sight-seeing missions over this park? If asked to do so they probably would, unless there is a special rule somewhere.

What I see in the future is permanent waivers issued by the FAA to state entities to control special airspace, similar to the NPS. Maybe that already exists beyond TFR’s. Maybe I’m all prop washed up. If it is peace and quiet the Park is after, why wouldn’t they also divert manned aircraft? Answer: They don’t have the authority. My personal take is that I’d rather not deal with drone noise in a state park, notwithstanding, the coordination of rules and jurisdictions have a ways to go yet. I’m sure the FAA is working on this and will come up with reasonable options for all parties.

 

[DavidLee]

What is wrong in this thread? What rules aren't followed?

flying in a state park where takeoff and landing of a drone is not allowed

 

[MS Coast]

flying in a state park where takeoff and landing of a drone is not allowed

See post #18. The OP clarified that he was operating outside the state park.

 

[Skywatcher2001]

I took the time to read all 3 pages (so far) of this thread. It is a good read with varying perspectives I believe in. Personally I feel it's been civil and enlightening. Only a few mentioned the very best solution.

I've been around for over 57 years and I have personally experienced the damage non-inclusion can do. Any time a particular group is excluded from enjoying anything everyone else can enjoy (then) the system is flawed (especially when you dictate to me specifically how to enjoy something). Pilots are a group. Compromise is the key. If you do not like me, fine. I will only be at this location on this particular day. You can have the rest of the year.

Disneyland has employee ONLY appreciation days; there are limited hiking permits, seasonal hunting days, etc. Manned aircraft are all over these parks giving tours.

I can go online and find a billion photos of the Grand Canyon . . . the only thing I can't find is a photo of me standing at the rim from an altitude of 50 feet . . . and the current laws state that I will never be able to have that . . . ever.

I do not wish to intrude or disturb anyone. I will wait hours for everyone to leave, spin up, maneuver, take the photo then I'm gone forever; but I will only do this legally; hopefully, someday.

I haven't been flying long enough to know If this 'compromise' was discussed in the formation of CFR 107 and the ban from takeoff/landing inside National Parks . . . but I'd have to think someone raised it.

 

[Defens]

Before dumping all over Rabber, th OP, I guess nobody bothered to look up the fact that the sculptures are NOT in Anzo Borrego State Park. They are on private property, the Galleta Meadows Estate, which is open to the public. I found no rules online that banned flights by UAS. Yeah, they are in the Anzo Borrego desert, but that's geographical area that encompasses more than the park.

 

[Starz]

Maybe you can fly over the park, but not takeoff or land on the property.

No maybe about it. They have no authority in the airspace over the park.

 

[MS Coast]

Before dumping all over Rabber, th OP, I guess nobody bothered to look up the fact that the sculptures are NOT in Anzo Borrego State Park. They are on private property, the Galleta Meadows Estate, which is open to the public. I found no rules online that banned flights by UAS. Yeah, they are in the Anzo Borrego desert, but that's geographical area that encompasses more than the park.

See post #18 and #33.

 

[Starz]

This regulation is not at all clearly written.

And they do that for a reason. Think of all the people that, since they don’t really know or understand the regulations, just turn and walk away when they could stand just outside the boundaries and fly in whatever direction they wanted. It’s up to each individual to make themselves aware of the true meaning of these laws and regulations. The enforcement people are there for enforcement only. Decisions on laws and regulations would be decided by a judge alone.

 

[MS Coast]

Some things never change, including selfishness.

This debate feels identical to the never-ending conflict between hikers and off-road mountain bikers over the Open Space Preserves here in the SF Bay Area.

Hikers want to ban bikers from the trails because it disturbs their peace. Mountain Bikers want to designate certain trails bike-only.

The solution is simple, but hard for the selfish: Compromise. I can think of many ways to accommodate the desire of both classes of users of State Parks so that nature lovers and recreational drone flyers can both enjoy the park in the way they want to.

However, as long as there are those who will not give anything, there will be bitter conflict. Watch it right here in many discussions.

Here's a question for those looking for peace and solitude, and the Park flyin' wannabes... Do you need to have what YOU want 365/24/7? Is there no willingness to give some days and/or hours to conflicting use that, well, you just don't use the park for that purpose when it's being shared?

Geez, that's the way we used to do things, people got along pretty well, and we all were generally happy and satisfied will our friends and neighbors.

Ever since Amerca got "woke", all social conflict seems to be about winning your viewpoint, no compromises, crush your opponent. This thread sounds a lot like that, at least the latest batch of posts.

I'm not seeing much monolithic, either/or, selfish hardnosed conflict here, nor any refusal of the possibility of compromise.

There are unquestionably places where drones and any powered machinery aren't appropriate. And the broad brush prohibition of drones from every part of every national park are unquestionably more restrictive than need be.

Drones are new and it's going to take time to develop simple courtesies, regulations, and laws for accommodating them. Unfortunately, a few people behaving badly have poisoned the well for all of us. The Park Service's total ban was a quick and simple solution for the bad behavior of a few drone operators who created serious problems at popular locations. It's going to take some interaction between the drone community and the regulatory groups and property managers to find solutions reasonable for all.

 

[snowghost]

I do not believe in Facebook. I only send my videos to know people who like to see my stuff. If you send to the Facebook crowd, I assume they are mostly lefties who try to control your lives. Sort of like the Tweeters too who only accept their concept of ideas and censor the rest.

I post to my feed on Facebook. Never had any complaint or gripe about the videos.

 

[bill1950]

Liberal drone hating media! And I don’t mean liberal denoting anybody’s political position but rather they can go anywhere and take any type of photograph and even had one reporter using a drone and was not registered nor was he a part 107 ended a piece explaining how the drone can be used for nefarious things and absolutely nothing positive about the drone! I contacted them with what I thought it would be an educational opportunity but what what I thought would be an opportunity turned into a 15 minute lecture I tried to explain the legality in plain English and reality of drone flying and their their illegal actions, the editor hung up on me, but it was pretty cool the FAA rep I called took down all the info, station call letters, time and date and gave a hearty thank you and assured me that he would reach out to the station and reporter. You got some splainning to do Lucy. Lol

 

[dave canada]

Key word.

igonarance isn,t bliss what good is done with drones outweighs not good by a large margin

 

[smashse]

It's been mentioned, but the Anza Borrego Desert is HUGE, and the state park, while big, doesn't nearly cover it. So, being in Anza Borrego is fine. And you can 100% fly over the desert, as long as you keep VLOS. Much of it used to be private, but there is also a lot of oil under there, so looks like the Gov't has been taking back large chunks. Also, none of the ORV people in the state park really observe signs or regulations (my families fence was constantly taken down for firewood). So, to encounter ORV's, hikers, etc in Anza Borrego, you can be on private land, or public land that isn't the state park. Mainly just need to make sure your feet are not in violation of the park req's and keep VLOS. I would also say, stay out of the park (no overflight) if they have rules, even if flying from the border, just to keep a positive relationship.

I live in MI now, and I asked the State if I could fly in a state campground. The answer was Rec yes, 107 no (without permit), but then they actually sent me an email stating that they have no jurisdiction in water, so I could launch and land from 1" of water, and they couldn't do anything. Also told me, as long as no one complains, they aren't likely to enforce anything... I don't fly like that, but it was all rec flight anyway.

So questions of legality, it's legal to even fly over the park, as long as the pilot is not. Ethically, IMHO don't fly over the park, but also don't worry if you cross 10' into the border at 200' up, with your feet outside the park.

 

[test2000Anafi]

The wording may be clear to you but the interpretation is subject to the whims of everyone charged with enforcing it. Some would interpret "within Anza Desert State Park" to specifically INCLUDE the air space above it. This regulation is not at all clearly written.

A much more clear statement might have read: ". . . on the grounds of the Anza Borrego Desert State Park."

Rule: you are not allowed to rob a bank
You: it doesn’t state anywhere ‘-using a firearm’ so the rules are not at all clearly written

 

[Tolipa]

I'm going to get lots of hate on this one, but I'm in the camp of people who think that State and National parks and drones don't mix. There are so few places left where one can find solitude. Can you launch your drone from the boundary of the park and then legally fly over that park? Yeah, you can. And if you do that, I think you're missing the point of parks.

On another note, not only did the OP not take the time to read the park rules, they griped about all the haters. What haters? That video didn't have a single comment.

I agree completely.

 

[MS Coast]

I agree completely.

I misunderstood his point, too. The OP was saying that the video he posted on Facebook received negative comments. The link he provided here was a separate posting of the same video on Youtube, where it hasn't received comments.

 

[Hermey]

I've been to Anza Borrego Desert State Park and environs a few times. I have photographed these sculptures with a standard DSLR camera, while standing on the ground. They are by metal sculptor Ricardo Breceda, and you can also visit his ranch just west of this area, where he has a huge display of many large sculptures, as well as smaller ones, and sells his sculptures. Ricardo Breceda | I visited his ranch as well.
The area where the sculptures are located is not within Anza Borrego Desert State Park. Rather they are just outside the park, around the city of Borrego Springs. However most of the mountains in the surrounding area, are within the State Park.

 

[Hidden]

Why do people hate drones? I made a video OUT IN THE DESERT. No people anywhere. Just me, my dog and my Mavic 2. I posted said video to a couple Facebook groups specifically for this desert ( Anza Borrego). What I got was a lot of likes and comments. There were also plenty of drone haters chiming in. Never mind the video showcasing the desert we love, let's just hate on the drone.

You can view my video at

and see what all the hate is about.

Because they are human.

 

[test2000Anafi]

Also some people hate bees.
Drones sound like bees.
Some people hate drones.

 

[DavidLee]

See post #18. The OP clarified that he was operating outside the state park.

post 18 was not done by the op, and he said he was flying in the ab desert