Some irresponsible drone owners

[TR Ganey]

Thanks. The feed is from Live Flight Tracker - Real-Time Flight Tracker Map | Flightradar24. I have a 2.00/month subscription. I think you can get one for .99. One of it's best features is using their cell phone app and having alerts set for any altitude in your general area. I set it for 1000-0 ft. That way if an aircraft is within range at a low altitude the app will alert me and show me the AC on the map. One of the really fun things is the mode in which the screen goes transparent and you point your camera at the aircraft flying overhead. All the information about that aircraft, it's altitude, airspeed, route, type of plane and call sign appears on the phone's screen. All that for a buck a month! IMHO, any tool out there that will keep me and others safe from spinning blades both big and small is worth it.

That only works if they have filed a flight plan and are running a transponder. Many pilots don't file flight plans for "Sunday evening flights" around the local area to sight see which are more likely to be flown at lower altitudes.

I didn't intend to make my comment in a condescending way I just don't want you or others to think that Flight Tracker or other apps like that are the end all be all as far as knowing when others are in your area. I do agree that anything beats nothing and commend any and all efforts to be safe.

 

[Mr. Salty]

Oh don't get me wrong. Absolutely do NOT fly irresponsibly especially near airports. But I think the severe crackdown where you basically have to be a fully trained pilot just to pass the small Canadian test to fly a drone is way over done.

I certainly don’t envy you for the test you’re saddled with in Canada. I’m anxious to see what the FAA comes up with for recreational flyers here in the U.S.

 

[AMann]

I certainly don’t envy you for the test you’re saddled with in Canada. I’m anxious to see what the FAA comes up with for recreational flyers here in the U.S.

When the FAA starts requiring a knowledge test for recreational flyers, will they include that part from the 107 test about unsafe pilot attitudes? It is actually pretty accurate and may help some a bit- Ive been guilty of some of them as well.

 

[lookin48197]

To all pilots. Quit making excuses and just follow the rules and regulations regarding our hobby. We all know that you are not supposed to fly near airports so why are we doing it? So what if there is no proof it was a drone, as stated earlier they really don't need any. I know there are hard headed pilots, out there that will do whatever they want. For all of us responsable pilots, lets keep doing the right thing. If we know of an unsafe act report it. That's just what we do.

 

[ac0j]

It would take an unusual bird or drone to go through the windscreen of a 787. However, there are loads of corporate and personal jets that ingesting something as rigid and frangible as a drone would make an engine unusable.

Has this been proven? Or are we just bandwagoning for the cause?
NO, you should not fly your drone around aircraft out of courtesy and for extra safety. But again I am saying those million dollar motors are more capable than most of us believe. Until it is proved that a drone injestion is fatal to a turbine engine, it should not be used as an argument. Not even taking into account the near impossible feat of getting one in a turbine engine suring normal flight in the first place. Even if you were trying to.

 

[Mr. Salty]

Has this been proven?

I've already given you a concrete example of damage caused to an aircraft by a consumer drone. By all means, dig in your heels.

 

[ac0j]

I've already given you a concrete example of damage caused to an aircraft by a consumer drone. By all means, dig in your heels.

Thank you for parroting the ONE case where there was a collision.
All I am saying is that case only proves there is no need to close airports over the POSSIBILITY of a drone in the area. Drones have not EVER caused a plane to crash.
Hitting the rotor was a much higher speed collision than would happen between an airliner and a drone.

 

[Mr. Salty]

You asked whether it’s been proven. It has. How many more examples would it take to convince you? I’m pretty sure you’re beyond being convinced no matter the number.

An airplane doesn’t have to crash. Damage is enough. And the first time a drone flying near an airport hits a commercial airliner, even with superficial damage, our little hobby will be much, much more restricted than it already is. Get your head out of the sand.

 

[m chaussettes]

I'm not a professional pilot but I have about 3000 hours with a little more than half being IFR and the last 100 hours or so in gliders. My entire life I have been in love with aviation. I do a lot of reading, get the NTSB report every month and pay close attention to anything that has the potential to affect my airplane or drone flying. I probably have some insight as to what a drone can do to a jet engine. I also asked my friend who gives check rides for Dassault Falcon Jet at Teterboro airport and the aircraft and powerplant mechanic who used to work on my airplane. They both concurred on the damage a small drone can do to an engine.

Here you go:
Although simulations using chickens shows how birds can damage engines, it turns out drones are a bigger threat because of their weight.

The damage that could be done to a jet engine entirely depends on the situation. Differently sized drones and different speeds could all change how the integrity of the engine is affected, but a closer look at the simulation below shows that in the event of any kind of crash, things won’t be pretty.

the clearance between a fan blade and the interior wall of the inlet is minuscule. Anything that can damage the vanes on a jet engine has the potential for bringing the AC down. The simulation was done by Virginia Tech’s CRASH (Crashworthiness for Aerospace Structures and Hybrids) lab. If you check out the link on Vimeo there is a link to the full publication of the results.

I'm not even sure what the question is. What I know for certain is that as long as we share 400 feet of altitude with aircraft of any type including commercial delivery drones, it is only a matter of time before the FAA is going to require training, a demonstrated knowledge of procedures, and some kind of practical test with a designated examiner.

 

[Starz]

Pilots are probably a little too busy around a commercial airport to stop what they're doing to whip out their cellphones and take a picture, don't you think?

Have you thought what one of those pictures may be worth? Plenty of incentive there.

 

[Mr. Salty]

Have you thought what one of those pictures may be worth? Plenty of incentive there.

I know a drone a few hundred feet away isn't going to look like much more than a little dot in a photo taken with a cellphone camera.

 

[K3CFPV]

Seeing the news reports of Gatwick and now Dublin and a recent post of a drone flight to over 33000' recently posted as a study in power efficiency reminds me of what Chris Anderson (3D Robotics) said at the first InterDrone conference - the hobby is suffering from a case of "mass-jackassery." I thought that the term was rather self explanatory.

 

[ac0j]

I'm not a professional pilot but I have about 3000 hours with a little more than half being IFR and the last 100 hours or so in gliders. My entire life I have been in love with aviation. I do a lot of reading, get the NTSB report every month and pay close attention to anything that has the potential to affect my airplane or drone flying. I probably have some insight as to what a drone can do to a jet engine. I also asked my friend who gives check rides for Dassault Falcon Jet at Teterboro airport and the aircraft and powerplant mechanic who used to work on my airplane. They both concurred on the damage a small drone can do to an engine.

Here you go:
Although simulations using chickens shows how birds can damage engines, it turns out drones are a bigger threat because of their weight.

The damage that could be done to a jet engine entirely depends on the situation. Differently sized drones and different speeds could all change how the integrity of the engine is affected, but a closer look at the simulation below shows that in the event of any kind of crash, things won’t be pretty.

the clearance between a fan blade and the interior wall of the inlet is minuscule. Anything that can damage the vanes on a jet engine has the potential for bringing the AC down. The simulation was done by Virginia Tech’s CRASH (Crashworthiness for Aerospace Structures and Hybrids) lab. If you check out the link on Vimeo there is a link to the full publication of the results.

I'm not even sure what the question is. What I know for certain is that as long as we share 400 feet of altitude with aircraft of any type including commercial delivery drones, it is only a matter of time before the FAA is going to require training, a demonstrated knowledge of procedures, and some kind of practical test with a designated examiner.

thanks for the link, but that was a cartoon, and PURELY speculation again. That is NOT proof.
I will say with a great deal of confidence that a turbine engine is a lot stronger than a lawn mower. And I am also pretty confident that I could run your drone over several times with a cheap walmart push mower without catastrophic damage to any cheap metal parts of the mower.
Again, I do not think one should fly a drone near manned aircraft, that is stupid and only done by stupider people.
BUT, dont spread fear based on what you think might happen, or from a computer graphic designed to mislead. When drone pilots themselves start saying a less the 2 pound drone will bring down an aircraft is almost as stupid as actually trying to do it. Even then your success rate in even trying to cause a collision would be VERY hard to calculate.
I just think as drone owners, we should NOT contribute to the misleading statements being made. And keep reminding people that The CHANCES of that happening are LESS than you being killed by a hailstone. That is a fact.

 

[ac0j]

You asked whether it’s been proven. It has. How many more examples would it take to convince you? I’m pretty sure you’re beyond being convinced no matter the number.

An airplane doesn’t have to crash. Damage is enough. And the first time a drone flying near an airport hits a commercial airliner, even with superficial damage, our little hobby will be much, much more restricted than it already is. Get your head out of the sand.

I can see you want to argue about nothing again. I agree with you.
There are all kinds of risks in life. Why dont we worry about drones going through CAR windscreens? Much more likely to happen, and just as likely to cause injury.
Until I see a drone fired into a turbine engine causing a catastrophic failure, Without having to be repeated several times for the desired shock value, I am not willing to say it is a real threat, and repeat that unfounded threat to others. I am sure it has been done, but they didnt get the "end of the world" results they want to keep jamming down our throats.
If you think you OR I have any control over what some idiots want to do, you are the one with your head in the sand. If we all agree on this forum to stay well clear of aircraft, you can rest assured it is still going to happen. Lets gets some REAL facts on just what the threat really boils down to.

 

[CanadaDrone]

in that line of thought, a well placed golf ball could too.
We are talking about a pound or two, of plastic, four SMALL metal motors, and a basically compressible battery pack. I don't know If I want to fly in any aircraft that couldn't chew that up and spit it out. Maybe they need to just make aircraft tougher, then there would be NO THREAT from ANY small airborne crafts or creatures in the vicinity.

Not everyone is flying a Spark or a Mavic though- if someone rammed a loaded carbon fiber Matrice 200 into a smaller jet engine or a pilot's windscreen, I suspect that could cause major damage. I am pretty sure the larger jets are designed to take some significant abuse but not everything is an A380

 

[Mr. Salty]

I will say with a great deal of confidence that a turbine engine is a lot stronger than a lawn mower. And I am also pretty confident that I could run your drone over several times with a cheap walmart push mower without catastrophic damage to any cheap metal parts of the mower.

If you knew anything about physics you'd know there would be a big difference if the drone hit your lawn mower going 500 mph, which is essentially what would happen if an airplane in flight hit a drone.

 

[ac0j]

If you knew anything about physics you'd know there would be a big difference if the drone hit your lawn mower going 500 mph, which is essentially what would happen if an airplane in flight hit a drone.

I am sorry I do not know what speed the mower blade spins, I would guess pretty fast, but I can not say 500MPH (cruising speed at altitude for a jet NOT really the 500" AGL speed one would expect)
I would throw out a random number, but I dont want to make my opinions look like facts, without FACTS!

 

[ac0j]

Not everyone is flying a Spark or a Mavic though- if someone rammed a loaded carbon fiber Matrice 200 into a smaller jet engine or a pilot's windscreen, I suspect that could cause major damage. I am pretty sure the larger jets are designed to take some significant abuse but not everything is an A380

Well, this is a Mavic forum. So when I say drone here, that is what I am talking about.
thats like talking about cannons in a hand gun control discussion!

 

[CanadaDrone]

Well, this is a Mavic forum. So when I say drone here, that is what I am talking about.
thats like talking about cannons in a hand gun control discussion!

For me anyways I found this thread in the "General Discussion" section, which is not Mavic specific (in fact many of the discussions have nothing to do with Mavics specifically). I'm not sure if it was double posted on one of the actual Mavic forums but I don't know how to check - sorry for any confusion.

 

[worldtraveller]

Do not forget that there are also some irresponsible pilots too. I have seen too many pilots in New Zealand (fixed wing and also rotary wing) breaking laws, including illegal low flying. Drone pilots get the blame and make the headlines, but there are pilots who are also guilty too. But if there is an incident, guess who gets the blame, regardless of who is actually at fault ?

Not always the drone pilot who is in the wrong.


Jerry