VLOS test

[fingers284]

This is sort of an add-hoc test that arose from my introductory post to the forum. Being a kind of red neck country bumpkin & the fact that an advertisement for the bird i bought had a "no license to fly" statement , I never even gave any other regs a thought....until I was jacked up in that post for flying out past what was any visual possibility.

A couple days ago I was flying in sky conditions that went from light grey clouds to light blue to dark blue. After flying a test pattern in all color schemes I have come to the conclusion that our birds should all be black.
The light grey color of my Mini SE got swallowed up by the grey clouds in 250 meters and after loosing sight of the thing, had to fly back to 200 m before it was easily sighted again.
Against the light blue, Not much better distance was achieved, 300-320 M and again had to fly back quit some distance before easy pick-out was noticed.
The dark blue sky was the best at 370 M but still not what I expected....

What I "expected" is what I watched that same day out my kitchen window while having morning coffee. That morning I watched a flock of ducks circling my neighbors field from a distance of 800 M or more and without aided vision I could make out the individual birds in flight. They weren't big by any stretch but they were very black & very visible . A sideways view of a duck is slightly larger than a drone but not much and these ducks were 800 M away and just above the horizon so were very much a side view for me.

So my conclusion was that the grey color of my drone was swallowed up by most any sky color we will fly in but those dark colored ducks are plainly visible from almost 3 times the distance.

 

[Deleted member 103366]

What we need is a Chamelon like skin, lol. (but how could it be controlled?)
I have an orange skin on a Mavic Mini and it once caught the sun at sunset, I was between the sun and the drone, it illuminated like a mini sun.
Strobes (white?) do help but to a limited degree.

 

[Phantomrain.org]

lol , Are number one selling Wet Suit is Black as well as the Rescue Jacket.
Everything turns to black in the sky pretty quickly , so good assessment.

Where having a color pays off is when you go looking for your drone in a tree or bush, or you are flying in close proximity
thu the trees , than having a bright to color can be really help your Visual line and depth .

Phantomrain.org
Gear to fly in the Rain.

 

[vindibona1]

That's pretty good distance you can see your Mini 2 from. I found a similar result of 400'-600' with naked eye. However, I fly with strobes and in the daylight I can see it just about out to 1600' feet or so, depending on the brightness of the sky. At night, unobstructed, with strobes, I have been able to keep VLOS out to 10,000' (Mavic 2 Pro).

As far as the hull being black, while visually it might be better, the one consideration of a dark colored hull is HEAT. In the summer it can be a problem. These drones need to disperse heat, not attract it. Reflective skin might be good if adding the weight isn't a factor.

 

[360 Guy]

Agree with the color black.
I have turkey vultures that fly around my area and they are quit visible at a long distance.
Just a thought here...........how about the left and right sides black, less heat the the entire bird in black.
There's your mission, let us know the outcome.
Anyone willing?

 

[Rquirk]

lol , Are number one selling Wet Suit is Black as well as the Rescue Jacket.
Everything turns to black in the sky pretty quickly , so good assessment.

Where having a color pays off is when you go looking for your drone in a tree or bush, or you are flying in close proximity
thu the trees , than having a bright to color can be really help your Visual line and depth .

Phantomrain.org
Gear to fly in the Rain.

Re finding your drone in a tree or a bush. I put patches of reflective life jacket tape on my pro, this would make it easier to find at night than during the day. When the beam from a torch falls on it it will shine back at you. Not that I have had to try it yet but I know how the tape responds to light.

 

[MavicAir2Marc]

I find orange to stand out since it's opposite blue on the color wheel. It's also handy for finding it on the ground should the need arise.

 

[GFields]

Interesting, thanks for sharing

 

[vindibona1]

I find orange to stand out since it's opposite blue on the color wheel. It's also handy for finding it on the ground should the need arise.

Yep. And that's why, if I go with Autel my drone will be orange.

I recall when I first got my Mini 1 and was flying it around the park, it would only be about 20' off the ground and 150' away and I'd lose sight of it, even against the trees. The only thing positive to say about the standard DJI color is that it resists heat.

 

[Cobra193]

That's pretty good distance you can see your Mini 2 from. I found a similar result of 400'-600' with naked eye. However, I fly with strobes and in the daylight I can see it just about out to 1600' feet or so, depending on the brightness of the sky. At night, unobstructed, with strobes, I have been able to keep VLOS out to 10,000' (Mavic 2 Pro).

As far as the hull being black, while visually it might be better, the one consideration of a dark colored hull is HEAT. In the summer it can be a problem. These drones need to disperse heat, not attract it. Reflective skin might be good if adding the weight isn't a factor.

This is a common misunderstanding of the VLOS rule. The rule expects you to be able to see the orientation of the drone in order to be able to fly it manaully in case video link and other telemetry is lost. VLOS does NOT mean you can see a spec, or strobe light in the sky.

 

[vindibona1]

This is a common misunderstanding of the VLOS rule. The rule expects you to be able to see the orientation of the drone in order to be able to fly it manaully in case video link and other telemetry is lost. VLOS does NOT mean you can see a spec, or strobe light in the sky.

In that case do what I do and fly with 3 or 4 strobes so that orientation can be maintained visually. I usually fly red/green on the front arms, or alternatively red/green front/rear with a clear on on the bottom and clear strobe on top.

 

[Cobra193]

In that case do what I do and fly with 3 or 4 strobes so that orientation can be maintained visually. I usually fly red/green on the front arms, or alternatively red/green front/rear with a clear on on the bottom and clear strobe on top.

Unfortunately, the rule states ‘without the use of aids’. Lights are an aid and something else that can fail, and if you’re a 1/4 mile out and they fail, you’re not going to be able to determine orientation.

Its stated very clearly in the rule and flying 2 miles out, with lights, and thinking you’re compliant is not correct. And there is no way, beyond 1000 feet that you can tell the difference between the colored lights, they would be a blob of colors.

 

[MAvic_South_Oz]

This is a common misunderstanding of the VLOS rule. The rule expects you to be able to see the orientation of the drone in order to be able to fly it manaully in case video link and other telemetry is lost. VLOS does NOT mean you can see a spec, or strobe light in the sky.

Unfortunately, the rule states ‘without the use of aids’. Lights are an aid and something else that can fail, and if you’re a 1/4 mile out and they fail, you’re not going to be able to determine orientation. Its stated very clearly in the rule and flying 2 miles out, with lights, and thinking you’re compliant is not correct.

I guess some pilots would then fall back to pressing RTH, to get it closer to regain video feed, or let it RTH failsafe to regain signal connection.
Good or bad ?
Well, usually it will work fine if flight settings / pre checks etc have been done right.

Agree, too far out and you lose the ability to have awareness of the surroundings, no more ability to see other than the cameras view, very limited scope, and no peripheral vision.
No awareness of other aircraft in your airspace, even if you can hear them, no way to tell direction, alt, speed, if there is a danger, and how to respond.

I find with my M1P, without strobes I can see it out to say 300m (~1000') ok . . . BUT, if I am filming or composing photos and look up from that distance, or look away from the screen, I have to use the map to ensure correct viewing alignment, and turn / move it a bit to find it again.
That's why I sometimes use strobes, depending on the flight background characteristics.

Tested my ARCII white out to a reliable 650 - 700m or so, but then it was the same with strobes, I'd still have to turn or move the drone a bit to spot where the aircraft is.

So generally, if I'm flying out to say past 300m, I'll put a couple of Duals or ACRIIs on, and generally stay at no more than around 500m distance, and less in some airspace situations.

All this is sunny daylight, we don't fly at night (rules), generally strobes are just used to aid getting VLOS easily in the above situations.

 

[Corsair415]

Unfortunately, the rule states ‘without the use of aids’. Lights are an aid and something else that can fail, and if you’re a 1/4 mile out and they fail, you’re not going to be able todetermine orientation.

Unfortunately, the rule states ‘without the use of aids’. Lights are an aid and something else that can fail, and if you’re a 1/4 mile out and they fail, you’re not going to be able to determine orientation.

Its stated very clearly in the rule and flying 2 miles out, with lights, and thinking you’re compliant is not correct. And there is no way, beyond 1000 feet that you can tell the difference between the colored lights, they would be a blob of colors.

FAA already stated to use lights that allow you to determine orientation at night. They don’t share your interpretation of “aids.”

 

[Cobra193]

FAA already stated to use lights that allow you to determine orientation at night. They don’t share your interpretation of “aids.

ok

 

[MAvic_South_Oz]

FAA already stated to use lights that allow you to determine orientation at night. They don’t share your interpretation of “aids.”

Not being in the US, but interested in the whole topic (will possibly apply here one day) . . .

When you fly more than a certain distance from the HP, it appears o me there is a point you can't tell not only the separation of lights on arms, but even the colours.
They sort of blend in together.

While this is fine until that point is reached, passing that makes colours and distinction (orientation) impossible.

Do others find this ?

As white is the brightest / most visible in daytime flight, I generally stick to this in the ARCII.
I do have a white / red ARCII and that isn't bad, but the Dual I have in green and red, if more than say 200m to 250m (approx 655' to 820' away, it becomes blurred to a point you can't tell colour or separation.

 

[-MavicMiniPilot]

This is sort of an add-hoc test that arose from my introductory post to the forum. Being a kind of red neck country bumpkin & the fact that an advertisement for the bird i bought had a "no license to fly" statement , I never even gave any other regs a thought....until I was jacked up in that post for flying out past what was any visual possibility.

A couple days ago I was flying in sky conditions that went from light grey clouds to light blue to dark blue. After flying a test pattern in all color schemes I have come to the conclusion that our birds should all be black.
The light grey color of my Mini SE got swallowed up by the grey clouds in 250 meters and after loosing sight of the thing, had to fly back to 200 m before it was easily sighted again.
Against the light blue, Not much better distance was achieved, 300-320 M and again had to fly back quit some distance before easy pick-out was noticed.
The dark blue sky was the best at 370 M but still not what I expected....

What I "expected" is what I watched that same day out my kitchen window while having morning coffee. That morning I watched a flock of ducks circling my neighbors field from a distance of 800 M or more and without aided vision I could make out the individual birds in flight. They weren't big by any stretch but they were very black & very visible . A sideways view of a duck is slightly larger than a drone but not much and these ducks were 800 M away and just above the horizon so were very much a side view for me.

So my conclusion was that the grey color of my drone was swallowed up by most any sky color we will fly in but those dark colored ducks are plainly visible from almost 3 times the distance.

Don’t let the Autel pilots get to you. Your drone is just as good if not better. lol

 

[Daytona500]

I agree with Mavic OZ 6 to 800 feet is about max I can see and tell whats going on with my drone. I seldom fly more then 600 feet.

 

[vindibona1]

I agree with Mavic OZ 6 to 800 feet is about max I can see and tell whats going on with my drone. I seldom fly more then 600 feet.

Strobes, clear red and green will potentially extend the visibility to about 1600 ft providing there are no obstructions to the LOS. .

 

[MAvic_South_Oz]

Strobes, clear red and green will potentially extend the visibility to about 1600 ft providing there are no obstructions to the LOS. .

Yes, I'd back that, 1600' is around 487m.
This is during daylight, at night (if we were allowed to fly at night here) it would be a lot further.
But day or night there is a diminishing point where you can't distinguish between red, green or white . . . but you can see white strobes a lot further that coloured ones.