VLOS ?

[Motorcycle Rider]

Looking up to see my drone interferes with my beer drinking.

 

[Motorcycle Rider]

Just kidding...

 

[itsneedtokno]

Your number one priority is to protect life and property. To do this you have to be able to find a balance of looking at the screen and your surroundings.
You not only have the birds, but flying over people, boats, and air craft including other drones ,kites and what ever this thing is below.

its ok when you first start flying to be hyptoized by the screen.
The same thing happens when you fire a gun , you focus on the sight but as your skills develop you learn
really quickly to get to the next level of shooter you have to learn how to keep both eyes open and still keep laser focus but be totally aware of your surroundings.

This happen yesterday, a back to the future machine came out of nowhere to sweep across the lake , where as I mind set was that I was just
getting ready to test Vlos .

View attachment 106499

I had no choice but to give him the sky, as he was oblivious .

That's a ParaGlider... Super super cool stuff. We get a lot of them here on weekends... Well, a couple miles south of here.

Great shot!

 

[KeviP]

This is a quote from "Visual Acuity" on Wikipedia:

The maximum angular resolution of the human eye is 28 arc seconds or 0.47 arc minutes,[18] this gives an angular resolution of 0.008 degrees, and at a distance of 1 km corresponds to 136 mm. This is equal to 0.94 arc minutes per line pair (one white and one black line), or 0.016 degrees. For a pixel pair (one white and one black pixel) this gives a pixel density of 128 pixels per degree (PPD).

Maybe someone technically minded could draw some conclusions from it with respect to the size of an average drone, it's beyond me

 

[Dbez1]

My biggest concern about flying beyond VLOS is the chance of a collision with a chopper or low flying small plane. I would feel beyond terrible if I caused the death of another person.
To the OP, my uneducated guess is that 99% of us on this forum have flown beyond VLOS at one time or another. How many drivers have never exceeded the posted speed limit?

 

[Ramjam61]

My biggest concern about flying beyond VLOS is the chance of a collision with a chopper or low flying small plane. I would feel beyond terrible if I caused the death of another person.
To the OP, my uneducated guess is that 99% of us on this forum have flown beyond VLOS at one time or another. How many drivers have never exceeded the posted speed limit?

It's human nature to explore. Iff it wasn't we'd all be living in isolated tribes still. The FAA and our CAA will be aware that people are going to "test" the limits of their drone. Just as the police are aware that Mr Jones in his Farrari is also going to do the same. The regulations for both drones and Mr Jones's car make perfect sense. However until something physically restrains both there will always be pioneers.

 

[1bad]

I think you have posed an interesting question but I have to wonder how many people will be inhibited to answer because it would be an admission of guilt. I'll be interested to read the responses.

I won't be afraid to say it, Every time that drone meets the sky it's go on beyond line of sight unless conditions are unsafe to do so. At some point you have to evaluate risk and understand where and when you are flying. I make the determination for myself of what is safe. I'm not reckless, I'm calculated, the law does not determine what is safe or what is morally correct.

 

[Scubadiver1944]

I'm surprised that no owners of Epson Moverios haven't chipped in thus far. Exasperated with losing VLOS to my Mavic 1 Pro, despite keeping the bird to within 500 metres, not to mention the washed out view on the screen of my Samsung tablet in bright sunshine conditions, I took the plunge and invested in the Moverio BT-300 HUD glasses and have never regretted it. I never cease to wonder how many posters on YouTube fly over built up housing areas, something frowned upon in the UK to say the least, not to mention posts of long range tests of umpteen miles, these sky jockeys seem to flout as many regulations as they think they can get away with. "VLOS? NEVER HEARD OF IT! WOT'S THAT?", seems to be their attitude.
Well, keeping your bird in view while continually glancing at your device's telemetry and lining up that killer photo and/or video on your screen isn't easy and if I had a pound for every time I lost sight of my UAV I'd be rich.
Fortunately, since I fly only in regions in the back of beyond and often in coastal areas, I rarely have problems since acquiring the Moverios. No need to keep glancing down at phone or tablet, just keep adjusting one's eye focus to view the drone right through the glasses or over/under the frames to maintain visual awareness and VLOS. Yet despite that at 500 metres in bright sunshine it's still possible to lose sight of something as small as a Mavic.
Therefore dedicated droners should consider either the BT-300 or BT-35e system. Not cheap, but if all one wants is cheapness, perhaps one should think about whether flying a top-notch UAV is something best left to others.

 

[Alex Baxter]

I am also guilty of the look down at the screen then look back up and where’s it gone.

Unfortunately, this going to be a high number. And most of those that would/do fly BVLOS, don’t understand why that’s even a rule. The proof in that is look at some comments made by those people. They’ll say things like ‘I can see my drone at 2000 ft’.

The whole point of the rule is that, in the event of systems failure (gps, video feed etc..) you need to be able to fly it home while in full control.

Having said that, it’s a silly rule if you’re in the middle of nowhere. If you lose control because you were too far away, I dont see how that puts anyone else in danger.

In perfect conditions I was able to see my MP at 750 metres, (bright clear day, white clouds) but just that glimpse down to see how far away I was did me in. Time for DJI to introduce a HUD, maybe like Google glass, with a reticle at the drone location, is that too far-fetched a notion, and will it comply with VLOS regs?

 

[Alex Baxter]

In perfect conditions I was able to see my MP at 750 metres, (bright clear day, white clouds) but just that glimpse down to see how far away I was did me in. Time for DJI to introduce a HUD, maybe like Google glass, with a reticle at the drone location, is that too far-fetched a notion, and will it comply with VLOS regs?

Oops, I see it already exists... Moverio BT-300 HUD

 

[THE CYBORG]

Oops, I see it already exists... Moverio BT-300 HUD

Your link sends me to - Beethoven The New Complete Edition

 

[Alex Baxter]

Your link sends me to - Beethoven The New Complete Edition

So it does LOL, try this, it's not a link epson moverio bt-300

 

[itsneedtokno]

Your link sends me to - Beethoven The New Complete Edition

Mine took me to amazon for the glasses... Dangit

 

[old man mavic]

Just kidding...

are you sure about that (just kidding)

 

[theDRONEranger]

Within the US, UAS pilots are limited to a 3sm distance. Within that 3sm one is expected to maintain VLOS. The VLOS distance is going to vary for each and every person. Myself, I watch the drone flying without my specs but must put them on to view/read the screen. My VLOS distance cannot, and never will, reach to the 3sm limits. I fully believe the FAA established the max distance as 3sm for safety purposes. Further, the generalization of of VLOS, is established to remain within the 3sm distance.

VLOS WILL vary with each and every person accordingly with their eyesight (and permitted use of corrective lenses). Beyond the VLOS, it may become a hazard to some pilots, depending where they fly. I.E., if one is within a 3sm distance of a hospital serviced by an aeromedical response system, then that does cover a lot of real estate. You may be absolutely fine where you are flying, but perhaps one mile or less to your right/left comes a Flight For Life helicopter. They fly fast and low, and lower than 400 feet very often, and without notice.

I live within the 5 mile radial base of class C KCOS. KCOS is not really that busy for a commercial airport. But, it shares with Peterson AFB and their C130s. Routine TOs & Ls, touch and go’s, same runways and different runways, always low passes and low level approaches. PAFB and KCOS, both have student pilot programs, meaning low passes all the time for who knows which direction. The USAFA to the north, Class D/G. Students fly out of Peterson to the USAFA, jump out, float to earth, wash, rinse repeat! Ft Carson to the south, C130s and helicopters galore. Have to admit, watching copter gunships flying formation over the city brings back some memories from my military time, Korea, West Germany, and the US (San Antonio) of course.

Obtaining LLANC is still no problem as long as my max altitude is 75 feet at the house. I am always aware there may be F4Ls, training, T&Gs. I live with it and with the altitude and distance established for where I fly. I do try to remain as cognizant as possible of my surroundings. VLOS does play a major part of my city flying. In the country, strobes and trying to remain below horizon level are my best friends. Going to the mountains makes it easier with that respect. Simply being aware of your surroundings is a major plus for safety.

Bottomline, yes the max is 3sm, but your visual perception/clarity is your guide! Be safe!

 

[Chuckinay]

this subject has been and still is a bone of contention for many people ,it does not matter how good or bad your eyesight is ,VLOS is a requirement imposed on us by legislation
a persons VLOS distance is dependant on many things apart from how good their eyesight is,weather conditions,background colouration being just a couple
i quite often loose sight of my drone when i am out at around 1000ft, i am watching it ok, then i look down at the screen to compose a shot or check my status levels on the screen,
and when i look back up to see the drone I struggle to find it, my method of helping to regain VLOS, is to have two white strobes on the front legs ,so if i cant reestablish VLOS i yaw the drone till it is facing me and then i am able to see the strobes flashing

Which strobes do you use for that, and how do you have them mounted? Visible to camera? (Can you post a pic?)

 

[Downloaderen]

I do...

 

[Ty Pilot]

Within the US, UAS pilots are limited to a 3sm distance. Within that 3sm one is expected to maintain VLOS. The VLOS distance is going to vary for each and every person. Myself, I watch the drone flying without my specs but must put them on to view/read the screen. My VLOS distance cannot, and never will, reach to the 3sm limits. I fully believe the FAA established the max distance as 3sm for safety purposes. Further, the generalization of of VLOS, is established to remain within the 3sm distance.

VLOS WILL vary with each and every person accordingly with their eyesight (and permitted use of corrective lenses). Beyond the VLOS, it may become a hazard to some pilots, depending where they fly. I.E., if one is within a 3sm distance of a hospital serviced by an aeromedical response system, then that does cover a lot of real estate. You may be absolutely fine where you are flying, but perhaps one mile or less to your right/left comes a Flight For Life helicopter. They fly fast and low, and lower than 400 feet very often, and without notice.

I live within the 5 mile radial base of class C KCOS. KCOS is not really that busy for a commercial airport. But, it shares with Peterson AFB and their C130s. Routine TOs & Ls, touch and go’s, same runways and different runways, always low passes and low level approaches. PAFB and KCOS, both have student pilot programs, meaning low passes all the time for who knows which direction. The USAFA to the north, Class D/G. Students fly out of Peterson to the USAFA, jump out, float to earth, wash, rinse repeat! Ft Carson to the south, C130s and helicopters galore. Have to admit, watching copter gunships flying formation over the city brings back some memories from my military time, Korea, West Germany, and the US (San Antonio) of course.

Obtaining LLANC is still no problem as long as my max altitude is 75 feet at the house. I am always aware there may be F4Ls, training, T&Gs. I live with it and with the altitude and distance established for where I fly. I do try to remain as cognizant as possible of my surroundings. VLOS does play a major part of my city flying. In the country, strobes and trying to remain below horizon level are my best friends. Going to the mountains makes it easier with that respect. Simply being aware of your surroundings is a major plus for safety.

Bottomline, yes the max is 3sm, but your visual perception/clarity is your guide! Be safe!

3 statute miles is mentioned in several places in the FAA regulations but it always referred to as a 'minimum visibility' reference, not as an absolute distance for UAV's. The visibility range is a standard in aviation and changes with meteorological conditions so - 3sm is our (UAV) minimum visibility because we operate VLOS. For 107 operations here is the section on limitations:

§107.51 Operating limitations for small unmanned aircraft.
A remote pilot in command and the person manipulating the flight controls of the small unmanned aircraft system must comply with all of the following operating limitations when operating a small unmanned aircraft system:

(a) The ground speed of the small unmanned aircraft may not exceed 87 knots (100 miles per hour).

(b) The altitude of the small unmanned aircraft cannot be higher than 400 feet above ground level, unless the small unmanned aircraft:

(1) Is flown within a 400-foot radius of a structure; and

(2) Does not fly higher than 400 feet above the structure's immediate uppermost limit.

(c) The minimum flight visibility, as observed from the location of the control station must be no less than 3 statute miles. For purposes of this section, flight visibility means the average slant distance from the control station at which prominent unlighted objects may be seen and identified by day and prominent lighted objects may be seen and identified by night.

(d) The minimum distance of the small unmanned aircraft from clouds must be no less than:

(1) 500 feet below the cloud; and

(2) 2,000 feet horizontally from the cloud.

 

[1bad]

Within the US, UAS pilots are limited to a 3sm distance. Within that 3sm one is expected to maintain VLOS. The VLOS distance is going to vary for each and every person. Myself, I watch the drone flying without my specs but must put them on to view/read the screen. My VLOS distance cannot, and never will, reach to the 3sm limits. I fully believe the FAA established the max distance as 3sm for safety purposes. Further, the generalization of of VLOS, is established to remain within the 3sm distance.

VLOS WILL vary with each and every person accordingly with their eyesight (and permitted use of corrective lenses). Beyond the VLOS, it may become a hazard to some pilots, depending where they fly. I.E., if one is within a 3sm distance of a hospital serviced by an aeromedical response system, then that does cover a lot of real estate. You may be absolutely fine where you are flying, but perhaps one mile or less to your right/left comes a Flight For Life helicopter. They fly fast and low, and lower than 400 feet very often, and without notice.

I live within the 5 mile radial base of class C KCOS. KCOS is not really that busy for a commercial airport. But, it shares with Peterson AFB and their C130s. Routine TOs & Ls, touch and go’s, same runways and different runways, always low passes and low level approaches. PAFB and KCOS, both have student pilot programs, meaning low passes all the time for who knows which direction. The USAFA to the north, Class D/G. Students fly out of Peterson to the USAFA, jump out, float to earth, wash, rinse repeat! Ft Carson to the south, C130s and helicopters galore. Have to admit, watching copter gunships flying formation over the city brings back some memories from my military time, Korea, West Germany, and the US (San Antonio) of course.

Obtaining LLANC is still no problem as long as my max altitude is 75 feet at the house. I am always aware there may be F4Ls, training, T&Gs. I live with it and with the altitude and distance established for where I fly. I do try to remain as cognizant as possible of my surroundings. VLOS does play a major part of my city flying. In the country, strobes and trying to remain below horizon level are my best friends. Going to the mountains makes it easier with that respect. Simply being aware of your surroundings is a major plus for safety.

Bottomline, yes the max is 3sm, but your visual perception/clarity is your guide! Be safe!

Can you post the reference where this information was pulled from?

This is the first I have heard of 3 square miles even in all of 107 training, especially since use of dedicated spotters can put you outside that boundary easily.

Thanks

 

[itismo]

The FAA knows you have to check your aircraft stats from time to time. When you drive do you not look down to check your speed or other engine stats from time to time? People flying full sized aircraft are always scanning the skies and their stats...they look down at their instruments from time to time...even at night. The requirement as I see it is you fly in a safe as possible manner within the rules, keep aware visually of where you are in the NAS while scanning for other aircraft. With your head stuck in the screen 100% of the time, it might make it easy to fly the drone but you need to be aware of the airspace around you as well. A video screen like on our drones is like what a horse sees with blinders on. It's better than nothing but not the best solution to see and avoid manned aircraft. As far as those who say strobes are not enough to meet VLOS requirements, I can see my aircraft at much further distances than without and definately helps to find the drone after looking at my instruments.

My point is, why the hell would I need to worry about avoiding manned aircraft while flying at an altitude of 70 meters? I believe a manned Aircraft flying at 70 m is in far more danger hitting something else like power lines or windmills other than my drone!