What are the rules on flying near birds of prey?

[stikflote]

@dan.utinske
It would be a lot easier to read your post if you did it in chapters

 

[antonebear]

I was just flying near these hills very early am .

 

[Surfnut]

Goshawk | The Wildlife Trusts

Known as the phantom of the forest, goshawks can fly through the trees at up to 40km per hour as they hunt birds and small mammals.

www.wildlifetrusts.org

protected species in the UK but is that in the UK?
I think the cars are on the wrong side of the road and it looks to hot/dry to me.

No, its not in the UK. Im sure its the States, but surely they have similar protections over there>

 

[Surfnut]

You can see by the shadow that the bird is already engaging the drone, when he realized that he turned around, and then he pursued the bird; then finally landed... and that's basically the correct way to act in situations like that.

When a bird is after your drone, first you ascend (no bird can follow an ascending drone) and move away, but if it still persists, following the bird to "show him who's the boss" is the way to go, else the bird will think you are a prey and will attack the drone (which was already happening at the beginning of the video).

And that doesn't mean you should fly near nesting areas.

Sorry, how can pursuing the bird be the right thing to do?

 

[MS Coast]

No, its not in the UK. Im sure its the States, but surely they have similar protections over there>

Yes, we do. The Migratory Bird Treaty Act was amended in 1972 to include all raptors.

 

[MS Coast]

If that isnt harrasment I dont know what is...

Could also be an intentional close pass or a chance encounter or a display of curiosity. In any case, it ended almost immediately and the bird flew away and perched in a tree.

EDIT: I initially understood that @Surfnut was suggesting that the hawk was harassing the youtuber. Yes, I definitely agree that the youtuber was unjustifiably harassing the hawk.

You can see by the shadow that the bird is already engaging the drone, when he realized that he turned around, and then he pursued the bird; then finally landed... and that's basically the correct way to act in situations like that.

When a bird is after your drone, first you ascend (no bird can follow an ascending drone) and move away, but if it still persists, following the bird to "show him who's the boss" is the way to go, else the bird will think you are a prey and will attack the drone (which was already happening at the beginning of the video).

That's illogical. Why does the bird not think the drone is the "boss" until after the drone's climb, descend, and disengage ritual? Why doesn't the bird see the drone as "boss" when it initially encounters it? Why was it necessary to go fly around the bird after it had flown away and perched?

Has this "show him who' the boss" tactic been tested in multiple cases? By others?

Another defense technique is to simply ignore the bird. I could argue that that's worked for me with the Bald Eagles, Ospreys, gulls, various hawks, vultures, swifts, swallows, and Purple Martins that have been near the drone. (Of course, I do avoid flying near them in the first place.)

Yes, there are documented bird encounters/collisions/attacks that resulted in contact with the drone and damage to the drone. But in all the ones I've seen or read about, the pilot had little or no time to conduct evasive maneuvers.

 

[Dangerly]

Hi guys. What are the rules about flying near birds of prey? There`s a guy posted on Youtube and he`s basically `buzzing` a bird of prey till it gets so agitated it goes to attack his drone. I told him he s an idiot and he s the type who gets responsible drone users banned from areas, but he wont accept hes done anything wrong. This is in the States I believe. Am I right?

Rules of thumb I've learned from experience about flying near birds of prey:

1. Most parks have rules about not disturbing birds of prey, and will even deny drone permit requests except for a few months of the year.
2. Hawks and eagles will defend their territory aggressively, and they can take your drone out if they want to. You can find the videos if you search.
3. I've been able to out-fly some hawks but it wasn't easy.
4. One way to survive an attack is to leverage the fact that birds can't fly straight up, or at least not very fast, so wait for the right moment to shoot straight up to get above them and then fly a different direction. Repeat until you're free.
5. Seagulls can be surprisingly aggressive although they are not birds of prey. They've gone straight for my drones before and I've taken evasive maneuvers.
6. I've found ravens to be more curious than aggressive. Same with hummingbirds.

 

[MS Coast]

I flew hang gliders for close to 30 years and have flown with many types of birds of prey and it is an awesome experience when they join you in flight.

I had some wonderful encounters with birds while flying gliders, though nothing ever involved contact. It was common practice to use circling hawks and vultures as indicators of thermals. I shared a thermal with an eagle in Tennessee once.
My old British glider instructor, Derick Johnson, swore that he was so good in locating thermals that the hawks followed him around.

Vultures are also marvelous and stunning in their thermal abilities and they probably determine we're not dead they tend to shy away from us.

Vultures never take prey on the wing, regardless of how dead it might be.

 

[Yorkshire_Pud]

Has this "show him who' the boss" tactic been tested in multiple cases? By others?

Uuum actually I have flown a drone, a Mini 1 or 2 perhaps, twice?, at single gulls that were passing enroute to somewhere else and seemed to be taking an interest in an exposed, small 'flying object',. When I flew it at them they turned and carried on on their original route. I had nowhere else to send the drone too and up wasn't an option, I was getting low on battery and over the home point.

Obviously it might just have been coincidence and I am not vouching for it as a tactic, this post is merely passing on an observation.

 

[MS Coast]

I got curious about the idea of drones outclimbing birds and looked for some numbers on rate of climb for birds to compare to drone specs.

I found a few good scientific papers, though little information on raptors. All indicated that rate of climb was inversely proportional to wing span. That is, larger birds climb slower.

A high rate of climb for birds looks like about 2 m/s. Black-Headed Gulls were measured at just over 2 m/s and starlings at about 3.3 m/s. The highest rate I found was for a Chaffinch at about 4.4 m/s. I'd love to find rate of climb numbers for a Peregrine Falcon, but didn't turn up anything.

By comparison, a Mini 2's climb rates are 2, 3, and 5 m/s in cine, normal, and sport modes, respectively. A Mavic 3 Pro can hit 8 m/s max.

So, from what I found, it's definitely possible to outclimb birds, especially in sport mode.

 

[Dangerly]

I got curious about the idea of drones outclimbing birds and looked for some numbers on rate of climb for birds to compare to drone specs.

I found a few good scientific papers, though little information on raptors. All indicated that rate of climb was inversely proportional to wing span. That is, larger birds climb slower.

A high rate of climb for birds looks like about 2 m/s. Black-Headed Gulls were measured at just over 2 m/s and starlings at about 3.3 m/s. The highest rate I found was for a Chaffinch at about 4.4 m/s. I'd love to find rate of climb numbers for a Peregrine Falcon, but didn't turn up anything.

By comparison, a Mini 2's climb rates are 2, 3, and 5 m/s in cine, normal, and sport modes, respectively. A Mavic 3 Pro can hit 8 m/s max.

So, from what I found, it's definitely possible to outclimb birds, especially in sport mode.

The DJI FPV hits 15 m/s. Add to that the fact that you can hit that vertical ascent straight up which is a trick that birds of prey can't match.

 

[Phantomrain.org]

Common Sense is key to any rule an I would not consider that to be offensvie in anyway to the bird or the drone. Most of us cannot tell a Turkey from a Penguine Falcon, lol So Common Sense must be the key not what type of Bird it may be.

Phantomrain.org
Gear to fly in the Rain, Capture the Storm an Watch birds very carefully.

 

[moldorf]

Thanks guys. Here`s the vid:

If that isnt harrasment I dont know what is...

yes it is and the pilot is a jerk

there are more than enough video and photo opportunities without harassing wildflife

 

[Capt KO]

Peregrine falcons and nests are protected and many have observers. Recommend staying clear of all raptors, especially Millennium Falcons..they have weapons.

 

[Mrprop365]

I got curious about the idea of drones outclimbing birds and looked for some numbers on rate of climb for birds to compare to drone specs.

I found a few good scientific papers, though little information on raptors. All indicated that rate of climb was inversely proportional to wing span. That is, larger birds climb slower.

A high rate of climb for birds looks like about 2 m/s. Black-Headed Gulls were measured at just over 2 m/s and starlings at about 3.3 m/s. The highest rate I found was for a Chaffinch at about 4.4 m/s. I'd love to find rate of climb numbers for a Peregrine Falcon, but didn't turn up anything.

By comparison, a Mini 2's climb rates are 2, 3, and 5 m/s in cine, normal, and sport modes, respectively. A Mavic 3 Pro can hit 8 m/s max.

So, from what I found, it's definitely possible to outclimb birds, especially in sport mode.

the air 3 does about 10 ms

 

[Dmcvey]

Keeping Wildlife Safe From Drones | U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service

We at the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service know that eagles are fascinating and fun to watch. Sometimes eager wildlife enthusiasts take their observations a bit too far. One emerging threat to eagles and other wildlife is an increase in harassment from uncrewed aircraft systems, commonly referred...

www.fws.gov

Under federal law, it is illegal to pursue, shoot, shoot at, poison, wound, kill, capture, trap, collect, destroy, molest or disturb eagles – including getting too close. For most human activities like tree clearing, road work and construction, we recommend a 660-foot buffer around an active eagle nest during the breeding season. However, there is no known safe distance to observe eagles or their nests with drones. It is also illegal to trail or pace an eagle with a drone while the eagle is in flight, regardless of location or time of year.

 

[halifax]

Yes, we do. The Migratory Bird Treaty Act was amended in 1972 to include all raptors.

Correct. It is unlawful under the federal Migratory Bird Treaty Act "to at any time, by any means, or in any manor, to harass, pursue, hunt, take, capture, kill, or attempt to harass, pursue, hunt, take, capture, or kill any migratory bird protected under the Act, which includes all hawks, owls, falcons, and eagles. All birds of prey in the United States are listed as a migratory bird and therefore protected. It is a class A misdemeanor with a $15,000 fine and up to 1 year imprisonment for violating the Migratory Bird Treaty Act."

The Treaty also applies to non-birds of prey as well, covering most neotropical migratory birds native to the USA (1100 species). So no chasing that song sparrow at your flying field.

I work for land trusts in Northern New England and I cannot use a drone to monitor birds of prey on our properties. Nor can I climb to or near their nesting sites for the same purpose without a USFWS research permit that is astoundingly difficult to procure. However, if you want to log the ^&*$#*&$ out of their habitat, causing nest failures and habitat alteration and abandonment, USFWS and the USFS will declare "No Impact" in their Environmental Impact Review and grant such permits like my mom giving out candy on Halloween.

 

[wcmead]

My mini 2 has been bullied by cliff swallows! They fly pretty fast, have lightning reflexes, and sometimes several in the area will swoop past the drone. Haven't figured out their psychology and why they sometimes buzz the drone and at other times ignore it. So far, many near misses and no collisions-- but the result is entirely up to the birds.

 

[MS Coast]

My mini 2 has been bullied by cliff swallows! They fly pretty fast, have lightning reflexes, and sometimes several in the area will swoop past the drone. Haven't figured out their psychology and why they sometimes buzz the drone and at other times ignore it. So far, many near misses and no collisions-- but the result is entirely up to the birds.

Swallows and martins are exceptionally curious about drones. I've had dozens of them orbiting around the drone, never with a problem. They're precision fliers and collisions are highly unlikely. Even so, I avoid any sudden movements with the drone when they're nearby.

 

[old man mavic]

as mentioned by @MS Coast above i have also flown many times, where there are small on the wing feeding birds,all around the drone ,just keep your movements slow as he mentioned ,they can fly much better than any drone, and have amazing manouverbility skills, the last thing they want to do is hit the drone,the best part is ,if you have been videoing at the time ,and you play back the sequence at home ,on a bigger screen ,is how adept they are flying in close formation with both each other and the drone
makes for some great footage