Battery query: How big or small a bulge before we stop using an MP battery?

[Balko]

I am very appreciative with the many well-intentioned comments I have been getting from this thread that I started regarding this battery situation I have stated.

However, there seems to be a split regarding what must be done with this situation.

Based on the EXPLANATIONS of “mnis” and other forum members, I am inclined on giving more time to observe tgis said battery.

 

[Balko]

“punctually deformation”, didn’t quite understand what this means?

“Punctual deformation”...kindly elaborate please.

 

[Balko]

The thing with 8 percent is nonsense. All that is really necessary is a complete cycle ... charging, discharging, charging. The emphasis is on "charging" because this is where the balancing takes place. Insert the battery into your MP and turn it on. You do not need the remote. The Mavic can gently discharge your battery ... wait until it turns off automatically. It consumes much less energy in standby than in use, but enough to empty the battery in a reasonable amount of time. Remove the battery and let it rest for 15 minutes when warm. Then fully charge the battery with the standard charger. As far as I can remember, you have not had any critical cell drift so far. But you can still check the voltages after charging with DJI Go. Be present during the procedure and check the battery in betwee

Hi ... The small post has been approved in the meantime The thing with 8 percent is nonsense. All that is really necessary is a complete cycle ... charging, discharging, charging. The emphasis is on "charging" because this is where the balancing takes place. Insert the battery into your MP and turn it on. You do not need the remote. The Mavic can gently discharge your battery ... wait until it turns off automatically. It consumes much less energy in standby than in use, but enough to empty the battery in a reasonable amount of time. Remove the battery and let it rest for 15 minutes when warm. Then fully charge the battery with the standard charger. As far as I can remember, you have not had any critical cell drift so far. But you can still check the voltages after charging with DJI Go. Be present during the procedure and check the battery in between for any visible changes. Incidentally, you could take another photo of the battery from another perspective and mark the suspicious spot for us.

Hi mnis.
I intend to follow the procedure of giving the battery a “complete cycle”. You said that after discharging completely, I should charge it after 15-minutes. Could I not just charge it probably a day after...probably on the day that I intend to use it? Is it vital that I recharge soon after discharging?

Yes, I would watch it closely during the procedure for any changes.

Btw, I took some pictures again of the slight bulge(the shape of an AA battery) but still not visible...even with the naked eye. It can only be slightly felt if we run a finger across the area.

 

[mnis]

I meant: A swollen battery is always deformed over its entire surface, similar to the balloon or airbag. At the center of the total area the swelling will be highest. And yes, you are welcome to use my remarks. I hope it is understandable and helpful enough, so that you can recognize a defective battery early.

The misunderstanding with the punctiform deformation I wanted to have dispelled with this post actually[emoji28]

 

[mnis]

I am not a prophet, and unfortunately I can not guarantee you what will happen. There is always a residual risk.

But obviously I've done a lot of battery care right in the past, and that's why I dare make recommendations.

My first five MP batteries were produced in February 2017, I had bought them between May and June. To date, there have been no failures or visible changes. Should it be a coincidence? ... Maybe YES, but I tend to NO.

Generally, I think the smart MP batteries are very reliable. And with regular research, I find only a few reports regarding exploding or frequently failing batteries.

The MP1 has been on the market for a relatively long time, and there are likely to be more negative reports on aged and improperly maintained batteries, as they are wearing parts.

Anyway ...
It is not my goal to dispel all concerns, it is my goal to give tips for the most effective battery care. Remote diagnosis is really hard. And so it is up to you to continue to trust the battery or even not. Watch well the cell voltages (drift) and the overall optical state of your batteries. Much more is not possible without additional effort anyway.

One more thing can be helpful, capacity measurements at regular intervals, but this requires additional equipment and time (costs less than a new battery).

After this post I will try to write something similar to the Ten Commandments of the Bible as battery care tips. I hope for many interested to be able to bring a little more light into the darkness...

 

[Nosebump]

Have you contacted DJI? I'm sure they have the answers that you're looking for, and the call is free.

 

[Balko]

Watch well the cell voltages (drift) and the overall optical state of your batteries. Much more is not possible without additional effort anyway.

Thanks, will certainly do that.

 

[Balko]

Have you contacted DJI? I'm sure they have the answers that you're looking for, and the call is free.

Maybe I should, thanks!

 

[mnis]

The Ten Commandments (Recommendations) of Battery Care for Li-Hv & LiPo [emoji748]️

#1 Every day with well over 60 percent charge is a really bad day for your battery [emoji599]

[emoji362]Try all your flights to plan and only charge your batteries immediately before the flight...

#2 Every hour with less than 20 percent charge is a bad hour for your battery [emoji615]️

[emoji362]Charge the battery cooled to storage temperature as quickly as possible to at least 60 percent...

#3 The reserve in flight starts with less than 30 percent charge [emoji457][emoji621]️

[emoji362]Search immediately a good place to land and fall below 30 percent charge only in an emergency, because only so you can effectively protect your battery from consequential damage...

#4 Do not trust the default of 10 days to automatic discharge, because this is a bad compromise between user desire of immediate usability and the required battery care[emoji613] [emoji848]

[emoji362]Choose for each battery only a maximum of 3 days. Every day less means a big plus for longer battery life...

#5 Always consider the ambient temperatures [emoji938]️[emoji848]

[emoji362]At ambient temperatures below 15 degrees Celsius, start with preheated batteries. And at temperatures well over 35 degrees start with appropriately cooled batteries.

Long-lasting heat is detrimental during storage and flight operations, it speeds up the aging process of your battery, and during the flight, the battery can spontaneously fail due to overheating.

Cold environment, on the other hand, slows down the aging process of battery chemistry during storage. In flight, however, a cold battery will temporarily lose power. If the battery can not come within a normal temperature range by self-heating, the performance will be greatly reduced.

Your battery pack is sealed and therefore protected from moisture, but that does not apply to its electronics. Therefore, avoid use and storage in cold climates in combination with high humidity.

Very important is the consideration for climate change from cold to warm, because condensation can occur here...

#6 Flying really does mean stress for these small, tightly calculated batteries [emoji615]️

[emoji362]Fly risky maneuvers (sports mode) better with more than 50 percent charge. Even strong winds and extra weight can have a negative impact on the overall life of your battery...

#7 Check the battery level of your batteries at least every three months, as recommended in general.
[emoji1001]️[emoji367][emoji353][emoji367][emoji353][emoji367][emoji353]

[emoji362]At best, check your batteries every month, and if the charge level drops below 50 percent, recharge your batteries. The automatic discharge (...if a short period of time has been chosen wisely) will then do the rest for you to bring the battery quickly back to storage voltage...

#8 Check your batteries regularly and look for any visible damage or unexplainable changes. Always keep an eye on the voltage curve of the individual cells of your battery packs and pay attention to the cell drift greater than 0.010 volts [emoji872]️

[emoji362]A visibly altered (damaged) battery must never be used again. And a regularly too large cell drift during use in flight with more than 50 percent remaining charge, can be a clear indication of the approaching total failure...

#9 There are no exceptions when using and maintaining your battery [emoji529][emoji205]

[emoji362]Always follow all safety instructions and proven care tips. Even the slightest misdemeanor has long-term negative effects on the performance and reliability of your battery...

#10 Optionally, it is advisable to check the available batteries with suitable equipment at actual available capacity at regular intervals[emoji367][emoji736][emoji367][emoji736][emoji367][emoji736]

[emoji362]Because the status LEDs of your battery give you only roughly the fuel-level. 100% are not synonymous with the manufacturer specified 3830mAh and is subject to aging processes.

And since a battery ages even when not in use, it is worth mentioning always alternative options such as use with other RC models or electric tools...

 

[Balko]

I will try to discharge the battery as you have mentioned, not necessarily with a remote...then will recharge it.

No, it doesn’t feel like a bubble. It feels more like the shape of a single AA battery.

I will try to take another picture when I have the battery with me. But it isn’t visible (the bulge) even when it’s in front of me.

@mnis:
Here are a couple of pictures. Can you even notice a bulge?

 

[Balko]

Pictures after “0” discharge/full charge cycle. No overheating nor change in the bulge.

 

[mnis]

Your battery looks absolutely good for my feeling.

I suspect it is a production-related unevenness under the nameplate.

Definitively, on objective consideration, this battery currently has no critical status ...

Anyway, I like your kind of cautiousness and fully understand your concerns.

Do not trust a statement by a single person, and always verify all statements regarding the handling of these batteries.

Try using all the information and tips you have to get the most out of your batteries.

Have fun flying and good luck. But think more of a nice flight with great shots, instead of all the bad things that could possibly happen ...

 

[Balko]

Your battery looks absolutely good for my feeling.

I suspect it is a production-related unevenness under the nameplate.

Definitively, on objective consideration, this battery currently has no critical status ...

Anyway, I like your kind of cautiousness and fully understand your concerns.

Do not trust a statement by a single person, and always verify all statements regarding the handling of these batteries.

Try using all the information and tips you have to get the most out of your batteries.

Have fun flying and good luck. But think more of a nice flight with great shots, instead of all the bad things that could possibly happen ...

Thank you very much for taking the time in sharing your invaluable thoughts and experiences. That goes as well with the others who gave their comments.

Happy safe flying to all!

Btw, I got into this hobby because of my love for photography. This time, from a different perspective...from above...using this flying DJI cameras, as I would like to call them.
...and if I may share some shots I’ve taken. (Not much Photoshop except for cropping)

 

[CliffordSh]

The Ten Commandments (Recommendations) of Battery Care for Li-Hv & LiPo [emoji748]️

#1 Every day with well over 60 percent charge is a really bad day for your battery [emoji599]

[emoji362]Try all your flights to plan and only charge your batteries immediately before the flight...

#2 Every hour with less than 20 percent charge is a bad hour for your battery [emoji615]️

[emoji362]Charge the battery cooled to storage temperature as quickly as possible to at least 60 percent...

#3 The reserve in flight starts with less than 30 percent charge [emoji457][emoji621]️

[emoji362]Search immediately a good place to land and fall below 30 percent charge only in an emergency, because only so you can effectively protect your battery from consequential damage...

#4 Do not trust the default of 10 days to automatic discharge, because this is a bad compromise between user desire of immediate usability and the required battery care[emoji613] [emoji848]

[emoji362]Choose for each battery only a maximum of 3 days. Every day less means a big plus for longer battery life...

#5 Always consider the ambient temperatures [emoji938]️[emoji848]

[emoji362]At ambient temperatures below 15 degrees Celsius, start with preheated batteries. And at temperatures well over 35 degrees start with appropriately cooled batteries.

Long-lasting heat is detrimental during storage and flight operations, it speeds up the aging process of your battery, and during the flight, the battery can spontaneously fail due to overheating.

Cold environment, on the other hand, slows down the aging process of battery chemistry during storage. In flight, however, a cold battery will temporarily lose power. If the battery can not come within a normal temperature range by self-heating, the performance will be greatly reduced.

Your battery pack is sealed and therefore protected from moisture, but that does not apply to its electronics. Therefore, avoid use and storage in cold climates in combination with high humidity.

Very important is the consideration for climate change from cold to warm, because condensation can occur here...

#6 Flying really does mean stress for these small, tightly calculated batteries [emoji615]️

[emoji362]Fly risky maneuvers (sports mode) better with more than 50 percent charge. Even strong winds and extra weight can have a negative impact on the overall life of your battery...

#7 Check the battery level of your batteries at least every three months, as recommended in general.
[emoji1001]️[emoji367][emoji353][emoji367][emoji353][emoji367][emoji353]

[emoji362]At best, check your batteries every month, and if the charge level drops below 50 percent, recharge your batteries. The automatic discharge (...if a short period of time has been chosen wisely) will then do the rest for you to bring the battery quickly back to storage voltage...

#8 Check your batteries regularly and look for any visible damage or unexplainable changes. Always keep an eye on the voltage curve of the individual cells of your battery packs and pay attention to the cell drift greater than 0.010 volts [emoji872]️

[emoji362]A visibly altered (damaged) battery must never be used again. And a regularly too large cell drift during use in flight with more than 50 percent remaining charge, can be a clear indication of the approaching total failure...

#9 There are no exceptions when using and maintaining your battery [emoji529][emoji205]

[emoji362]Always follow all safety instructions and proven care tips. Even the slightest misdemeanor has long-term negative effects on the performance and reliability of your battery...

#10 Optionally, it is advisable to check the available batteries with suitable equipment at actual available capacity at regular intervals[emoji367][emoji736][emoji367][emoji736][emoji367][emoji736]

[emoji362]Because the status LEDs of your battery give you only roughly the fuel-level. 100% are not synonymous with the manufacturer specified 3830mAh and is subject to aging processes.

And since a battery ages even when not in use, it is worth mentioning always alternative options such as use with other RC models or electric tools...

Hi, I have a similar issue over here. Please assist.

Out of 3 batteries, a single one bloated and bulged out a lot. According to DJI, that happened as I went out full throttle in sports mode for more than 5 minutes straight without a break (It's true )

I immediately stopped using it.
It had about 30-40% charge. I marked the battery and put it inside a dry (relatively cool) storage.

Now, after about a month, I took that battery out from my Dry storage, and I see that the bulge is COMPLETELY gone. The bulge earlier was massive. The battery would not even fit properly inside the Mavic. (Mavic Pro)

Today, I installed the battery in the drone but didn't turn it on and it seems it fit perfectly just like the other two pieces.

It shows that it is 100% charged ?!?!
I remember clearly that it had about 40% the day I stored it and never really charged it. Today, all 4 green lights turn up.

What do you recommend? Should I charge up the battery and keep using it? Or should I still discard it? Please recommend.

Just a side note, my Mavic Pro is just 4 months old and bought new from DJI Website along with Fly More Combo. The affected battery is just months old with about 30 cycles.

Never going to use Sports Mode again [emoji14]

Another note, this battery, before it wouldn't fit, but had a slight bulge, lasted for as long as 28 minutes (tested). Where as, the other batteries lasted for 19 - 21 minutes at maximum.

 

[CliffordSh]

Hi, I have a similar issue over here. Please assist.

Out of 3 batteries, a single one bloated and bulged out a lot. According to DJI, that happened as I went out full throttle in sports mode for more than 5 minutes straight without a break (It's true )

I immediately stopped using it.
It had about 30-40% charge. I marked the battery and put it inside a dry (relatively cool) storage.

Now, after about a month, I took that battery out from my Dry storage, and I see that the bulge is COMPLETELY gone. The bulge earlier was massive. The battery would not even fit properly inside the Mavic. (Mavic Pro)

Today, I installed the battery in the drone but didn't turn it on and it seems it fit perfectly just like the other two pieces.

What do you recommend? Should I charge up the battery and keep using it? Or should I still discard it? Please recommend.

Just a side note, my Mavic Pro is just 4 months old and bought new from DJI Website along with Fly More Combo. The affected battery is just months old with about 30 cycles.

Never going to use Sports Mode again [emoji14]

Another note, this battery, before it wouldn't fit, but had a slight bulge, lasted for as long as 28 minutes (tested). Where as, the other batteries lasted for 19 - 21 minutes at maximum.

Here are the battery images. Please assist. I can't find the battery bulge images right now...

 

[mnis]

Thank you very much for taking the time in sharing your invaluable thoughts and experiences. That goes as well with the others who gave their comments.

Happy safe flying to all!

Btw, I got into this hobby because of my love for photography. This time, from a different perspective...from above...using this flying DJI cameras, as I would like to call them.
...and if I may share some shots I’ve taken. (Not much Photoshop except for cropping)

Great shots ...
I do not know if I would succeed as well.
I bought my MP because I appreciate this type of aircraft mainly for technical reasons. I like the minor matter of filming and photography, no question, but my demands in this regard are really small.

And so I trust during the flights the existing automatics. So probably the coincidence brings me some pretty scenes, which I would have to extract from the Full HD movies ...

 

[mnis]

Here are the battery images. Please assist. I can't find the battery bulge images right now...View attachment 54856View attachment 54857View attachment 54858

Hello!
Very interesting information [emoji106]

The sport mode is a real battery killer. I would firmly and permanently weld the switch to the remote control so that it can no longer be operated [emoji36]

The Mavics are photo drones and not racing machines. What did DJI think?

I know that a cool storage of the batteries can sometimes reduce the bulges and even make them disappear.

That the problematic battery with its status LED's indicates a normal condition is ever a good sign, but unfortunately says nothing about its remaining capacity.

Anyway ...
It is very likely that after such an incident permanent damage will remain in the cell structure of the battery. This means that at least one of the three battery cells in the package will permanently have more capacity than the others lost.

I would do the following before giving up this battery:

#1 Ask DJI for an exchange (warranty or goodwill) as no six months have passed yet.

If a return is not accepted by DJI:

#2 If the battery case is damaged, I would no longer want to fly with this battery, but consider an alternative use.

#3 Give the problematic battery a few (2 to 3) cycles without stress. Charge the battery with the standard charger and discharge the battery until it switches off automatically in the quadrocopter (standby mode). Monitor the voltage profile of all battery cells in the DJI Go Battery Info. If a battery cell drifts between 60 and 100 percent battery charge more than 0.030 volts, then it is an existing problem and in flight operation, the bulge is very likely to recur at low battery levels. Again, I would not want to use the battery to fly anymore.

#4 If there were no abnormalities up to here, I would want to determine the actually remaining capacity of the battery!

Without additional equipment, you can at least make rough comparisons. Take all your full batteries and discharge them in succession in your quadcopter (standby mode), note the elapsed time until the automatic shutdown. The battery with the longest endurance is then the reference (100%). Compare all times with each other and calculate the deviations mathematically as percentages. So you can even estimate which battery still offers enough time.

A battery that offers less than 15 minutes of flight time in normal conditions I would opt out...

 

[Balko]

Hi everyone! It’s been a while since we were on this thread for this battery issue. I have recently used the said battery a couple of times and the”bulge” remained the same.
However, I noticed that it seemed to get hotter more quickly than my other battery.
If I remember correctly, it reached something like 47-degrees after less than 50% flight time (not very sure of this figure but definitely hotter to the touch).

What is the allowable maximum temp?

 

[Nosebump]

I would treat a battery that’s swelling, or heating up differently, seriously. It’s a hint that all is not well. The consequences can be extreme, with an intense fire a district possibility. That happens all to frequently with cell phone batteries.

Swelling is an indication that the protective membrane has been breached, exposing various battery chemicals to ambient moisture. That’s where the bad stuff begins.

Swelling in a drone battery could manifistate itself by having the battery abruptly come loose from its clamps, or the battery losing voltage in-flight.

Do the conservative sensible thing and discard the thing. Why take a chance?

 

[mnis]

I would treat a battery that’s swelling, or heating up differently, seriously. It’s a hint that all is not well. The consequences can be extreme, with an intense fire a district possibility. That happens all to frequently with cell phone batteries.

Swelling is an indication that the protective membrane has been breached, exposing various battery chemicals to ambient moisture. That’s where the bad stuff begins.

Swelling in a drone battery could manifistate itself by having the battery abruptly come loose from its clamps, or the battery losing voltage in-flight.

Do the conservative sensible thing and discard the thing. Why take a chance?

I would rather say the following:
Swelling is still NOT an indication that the protective membrane (outer shell) has been breached. And with the layered LiPo's / HV LiPo's the electrolyte is not a liquid part of the battery. A crack of the outer LiPo shell does not emit any chemicals in liquid form. And ... On the basis of the few existing videos showing an out-of-control DJI Mavic battery, less can be expected from a burning. Much more problematic seems to be the enormous (toxic) smoke that can not be stopped.