Hospital Helipads

[7KJT7Y2I]

When I've called hospitals with helipads to discuss my nearby drone ops, I've repeatedly been told, "but you can't fly within 5 miles."

The rule was changed. Does anyone know exactly what part of the FAR relates to this? I want to be able to cite the exact new, more relaxed regulation regarding helipads.

Thanks -
Eric

 

[DroningOn]

Just don’t interfere with any helicopters taking off or landing.... problem solved, have fun

 

[7KJT7Y2I]

Obviously I'll be doing that. But I'm interested in maximizing Safety. In my opinion, there is no "problem solved" when it comes to safety procedures. It can always, and should be improved. The more dialogue the better

 

[brett8883]

When I've called hospitals with helipads to discuss my nearby drone ops, I've repeatedly been told, "but you can't fly within 5 miles."

The rule was changed. Does anyone know exactly what part of the FAR relates to this? I want to be able to cite the exact new, more relaxed regulation regarding helipads.

Thanks -
Eric

2018 FAA Reauthorization Act Section 349 of H. 304: EXCEPTION FOR LIMITED RECREATIONAL OPERATIONS OF UNMANNED AIRCRAFT

Section 336 of the 2012 FAA Reauthorization Act(the law that said you had to notify within 5 miles) was repealed in the 2018 FAA Reauthorization Act. The FAA Reauthorization Act of 2018 EXCEPTION FOR LIMITED RECREATIONAL OPERATIONS OF UNMANNED AIRCRAFT doesn’t mention anything about 5 miles and only requires authorization from the FAA through LAANC when flying within controlled airspace. Therefore, you do not need to call or notify the helipads at all. You can if you want to and if they push back just tell them to call the FAA so they can learn the rules for themselves. No use in getting into it with someone.

You still have to give way to manned aircraft at all times

 

[brett8883]

No law ever said you can’t fly within 5 miles you just had to notify them of operations within 5 miles. This is no longer the case

 

[7KJT7Y2I]

2018 FAA Reauthorization Act Section 349 of H. 304: EXCEPTION FOR LIMITED RECREATIONAL OPERATIONS OF UNMANNED AIRCRAFT

Section 336 of the 2012 FAA Reauthorization Act(the law that said you had to notify within 5 miles) was repealed in the 2018 FAA Reauthorization Act. The FAA Reauthorization Act of 2018 EXCEPTION FOR LIMITED RECREATIONAL OPERATIONS OF UNMANNED AIRCRAFT doesn’t mention anything about 5 miles and only requires authorization from the FAA through LAANC when flying within controlled airspace. Therefore, you do not need to call or notify the helipads at all. You can if you want to and if they push back just tell them to call the FAA so they can learn the rules for themselves. No use in getting into it with someone.

You still have to give way to manned aircraft at all t

I've said the exact same thing, 'you call the FAA, don't take my word for it",' but there's nothing like being able to cite everything on the spot. It's why I carry a legal handbook with me at all times, with copies of the specific regulations pertaining to my drone ops. So it's not only for others (hospitals), but it's also for my own knowledge and rule/law/regulation handbook

 

[7KJT7Y2I]

Got it. Thanks for the info! I had two hospitals tell me that it was a complete no-fly zone. I forgot that that wasn't even the rule in the first place, like you're saying!

 

[DroningOn]

Obviously I'll be doing that. But I'm interested in maximizing Safety. In my opinion, there is no "problem solved" when it comes to safety procedures. It can always, and should be improved. The more dialogue the better

You just said you weren’t going to interfere with helicopter operations. How much safer can you get?

 

[7KJT7Y2I]

Situational awareness is a huge, huge component of aviation safety. In the real world, there are often factors you didn't plan for. It's not as simple as "I'm going to avoid interfering with helicopter ops". On the surface it may be, but things aren't always predictable. Improved situational awareness buys precious time in an emergency.

I take the avoidance of medevac helicopters very seriously. The safest approach is to maximize communication and be able to yield the right away. I'm not talking about some formal, burdensome process, though. It should be within reason, and what I am doing is just that. It's not time-consuming.

 

[Camino Ken]

You might want to ask if there are recommended flight paths. At regular airports, helicopters are usually required to follow the approach and departure guidelines specific to that airport. I’m not sure if it is the same at a dedicated helipad but it does make sense that they would have a recommended flight directions for incoming versus departing helicopters to reduce risk of collisions. If they have these and you know them it’s easier to avoid any issues.

 

[7KJT7Y2I]

You might want to ask if there are recommended flight paths. At regular airports, helicopters are usually required to follow the approach and departure guidelines specific to that airport. I’m not sure if it is the same at a dedicated helipad but it does make sense that they would have a recommended flight directions for incoming versus departing helicopters to reduce risk of collisions. If they have these and you know them it’s easier to avoid any issues.

Thanks for the suggestions! I've noticed a pattern in landing approaches for several of these hospitals on ADSB flight trackers, so I completely get what you're saying. Do you think this is the kind of thing I should ask the FAA about these typical approach procedures?

 

[Camino Ken]

Thanks for the suggestions! I've noticed a pattern in landing approaches for several of these hospitals on ADSB flight trackers, so I completely get what you're saying. Do you think this is the kind of thing I should ask the FAA about these typical approach procedures?

You could try but it is probably privately owned and there is typically limited info. You could try finding out from the hospital who is responsible for helicopter flight operations. It could even be a third party service.

 

[7KJT7Y2I]

You could try but it is probably privately owned and there is typically limited info. You could try finding out from the hospital who is responsible for helicopter flight operations. It could even be a third party service.

Do you think maybe reaching out to the medevac helo companies would be a good way,? Just go straight to the people who are flying themselves?

 

[DoomMeister]

Whether you fly under Recreational rules, Part 107, or a Part 333 Exemption the Rules now go by the Class of airspace you are flying in. If you are in controlled airspace you need clearance through LAANC or the FAA DroneZone. If you are in Class G airspace you do not need clearance. In any case you must give right of way to manned aircraft (yes I see you already know that). I commend you for wanting to go the extra step to help insure your flights are safe and do not interfere with the medevac flights in your area.

I think contacting the heli companies involved with flights in your area are the best bet. I think their flight coordinator will give you the information about flight paths you seek. They may also give you a way to contact them when you are conducting flights and have them alert you by phone if they will be operating in your flight area.

Thank you for being one of the conscientious and safe sUAS pilots!

 

[7KJT7Y2I]

I'm not talking about flying in controlled airspace necessarily -- I'm also talking about LAANC. So it's G or flying with LAANC/authorization(drone zone) controlled airspace. I'm equally interested in improved safety near helipads -- regardless of what kind of airspace they're in -- and I'm assuming I'm flying 100% legally, yielding right of way, etc.

Thanks for the suggestion! Ultimately it would be great to see the FAA spearhead an effort to create a protocol or SOP for drone pilots to contact helipads (especially hospital and police ones). It would be great if they were able to distribute a set of simple, suggested, more formal guidelines for how to contact a hospital. I've usually been directed to security, but they're always confused and mistaken about drones. If the FAA distributed these guidelines, security people, helicopter companies, etc. can see that there's a framework for making things happen safely. They can immediately refer to a proven, simple process

One great thing though that is the first line of defense -- Most medevac helicopters have their ADSB transponder on. You can see them from a long, long distance and act accordingly. This is why I have a forearm mounted iPhone with an ADSB map from (usually) planefinder.I got the idea from seeing quarterbacks. I realized it's a great way to present technical information in an unobtrusive way. I always have that ADSB map up, monitoring it continuously. The Mavic 2 Enterprise has this feature built-in to the app, so that's cool too. But there's nothing like a dedicated smartphone running an ADSB tracker. I also FR24 and ADSBExchange depending on certain factors

 

[DoomMeister]

I have both a hospital and police helipad close to my area. In the past I tried contacting them. The sheriff’s department doesn’t man the phone listed for the pad, but it is very rarely used. The hospital number listed for the pad is the general number there and the volunteer staff answering the phone is clueless. When a flight is inbound they just contact the ER to let them know they are on the way and have a crew meet them at the pad near the ER.

With a number of small private airstrips around the area the MedEvac flights tend to be rather low in altitude and most likely are around 350’ to 400’ AGL to stay below most fixed wing air traffic.

 

[7KJT7Y2I]

I have both a hospital and police helipad close to my area. In the past I tried contacting them. The sheriff’s department doesn’t man the phone listed for the pad, but it is very rarely used. The hospital number listed for the pad is the general number there and the volunteer staff answering the phone is clueless. When a flight is inbound they just contact the ER to let them know they are on the way and have a crew meet them at the pad near the ER.

With a number of small private airstrips around the area the MedEvac flights tend to be rather low in altitude and most likely are around 350’ to 400’ AGL to stay below most fixed wing air traffic.

 

[Camino Ken]

Do you think maybe reaching out to the medevac helo companies would be a good way,? Just go straight to the people who are flying themselves?

Worth a try. Good luck.

 

[KB9Radio]

When I've called hospitals with helipads to discuss my nearby drone ops, I've repeatedly been told, "but you can't fly within 5 miles."

The rule was changed. Does anyone know exactly what part of the FAR relates to this? I want to be able to cite the exact new, more relaxed regulation regarding helipads.

Thanks -
Eric

If you live or fly that close to a hospital, why don't you just fly low and carefully, and pay attention. Any time a medivac helicopter gets down to the 400' range, they are very easy to hear coming in and getting very close to the hospital. Hospitals have many different things going on and really don't need to be bothered by someone who wants to fly his drone in his backyard. I think if you stir the hive, you're likely to get stung, and all the other drone operators in your area may pay the price as well. All you need to do is annoy the wrong person and have them go to the city council. These councils tend to listen to these folks and on any evening can make an ordinance to shut down you and all the other drone operators in any radius they feel like, regardless of what the FAA rules are. My advice, fly keeping it reasonable and use good situational awareness. Stating rules and regulations to these folks, will only lead to additional rules and regulations.

 

[bcfd29]

As a suggestion: medevac flights are either conducted by private contractors or police or fire entities (or both depending on location). Try and locate the medevac provider and call their operations center. If your looking at flights on a tracker, searching the N number of the helo should get you to the company that owns and operates them. Their ops center would likely appreciate the heads up and ask for a contact# to advise you of any activity inbound to the hospital. Re: the police, this is a great opportunity to make connections there and do the same thing; calling the non emergency# of your communications center or 911 PSAP will get you the ability to have someone from aviation call you back.

Your doing the right stuff, wish more people would also. Even a lightweight uas versus a rotorcraft can result in a bad day. Did a medevac accident scene landing a few years ago and as the aircraft was on final saw RC aircraft nearby...not good. Helo had to abort and go around delaying transport, fortunately no contact occurred.