How to estimate likely alt of manned aircraft landing

[gnirtS]

Very very roughly 300ft per nautical mile. Circuit altitude roughly 1000ft.
Heights would be QFE so above airfield level not AMSL.

 

[Davros007]

AirMap will show max allowable altitudes for drone flight on a map. There is also FAA info on the site linked below... zoom in for local details, maybe it will give you the info you’re looking for.

ArcGIS Web Application

faa.maps.arcgis.com

I think what they’re asking for is kinda like the reverse- a map that shows the minimum height for manned aircraft in an area...

 

[Jet skier]

I flew near an airport the other day, about 3 miles away. It was class E and I did the dji unlock zone thing.
It was a somewhat overcast day, and I did not see or hear anyone using the airport for the two hours I was out there.
It occurred to me that I don't know what the ranges for approach heights for manned aircraft about to land.
I have flown in a few cessnau's and other small planes, so have some idea, but at some distance from the runway, the planes pop below the 500 ft level.
How would I educate myself on this in the simplest way? I believe there are charts for approaches, but it must vary by type of plane.
Or maybe not. I researched this some but am asking to see what others recommend.
thanks

Download flight radar 24 app it shows all aircraft and they’re real time altitudes and speed and more information it’s a great app I use it all the time

 

[gnirtS]

Download flight radar 24 app it shows all aircraft and they’re real time altitudes and speed and more information it’s a great app I use it all the time

But it also wont show the aircraft most likely to conflict with a drone such as light aircraft, helicopters, gliders and military.
(and anyone can opt-out of fr24 tracking..many do).

 

[DougMcC]

This may be what you want. A plane entering a pattern does so about 1000 ft AGL at about a 45 degree angle to the runway about the mid length of the runway. The aircraft then turns 45 degrees to parallel the runway flying downwind will stay probably 500-800 ft away from the runway. No descent below the 1000 agl starts until a later 90 degree turn to cross and intercept the runway midline final approach. That turn from downwind to base to final is where the descent and slowing of the aircraft occurs. The aircraft will probably turn to the runway into final at a distance that allows about a 10 - 15 degree approach angle to the runway. Different planes different speeds and instrument published approaches can be different than what I’ve described. But most of the landing turns and setup occurs at least 700-1200 feet AGL. Emergent landings will not be carried out in the described “pattern”. Student pilots may be lower than described. Best to avoid airport traffic areas and not distract pilots.

 

[Gindra]

I like using the FlightRadar24 app which gives me the speed and elevation of aircraft in my area. I really had no idea of what the elevation of various aircraft was when eyeballing it.

 

[Jet skier]

But it also wont show the aircraft most likely to conflict with a drone such as light aircraft, helicopters, gliders and military.
(and anyone can opt-out of fr24 tracking..many do).

I didn’t know you had to opt into it

 

[Jet skier]

But it also wont show the aircraft most likely to conflict with a drone such as light aircraft, helicopters, gliders and military.
(and anyone can opt-out of fr24 tracking..many do).

That’s not true it shows helicopters ,small airplanes , everything

 

[gnirtS]

That’s not true it shows helicopters ,small airplanes , everything

Quite simply it doesn't. It only shows aircraft that have ADS-B fitted. A majority of commercial aircraft do. That isnt the case for GA aircraft, even in the states.
The FR24 block and opt out list alone runs to a few thousands aircraft even of those that DO send it.

You should go about ADS-B and the requirements. Its not a universal show-all system. And its even worse going through 3rd party data providers like FR24 you can opt out of.

 

[Jet skier]

Quite simply it doesn't. It only shows aircraft that have ADS-B fitted. A majority of commercial aircraft do. That isnt the case for GA aircraft, even in the states.
The FR24 block and opt out list alone runs to a few thousands aircraft even of those that DO send it.

You should go about ADS-B and the requirements. Its not a universal show-all system. And its even worse going through 3rd party data providers like FR24 you can opt out of.

Does that mean the little picture of a whirling helicopter and small planes is fictional it is showing live on the app

 

[gnirtS]

Does that mean the little picture of a whirling helicopter and small planes is fictional it is showing live on the app

No it means its a helicopter that for whatever reason the owner decided to fit an ADS-B transmitter. Either because they felt like it or for compliance when it eventually becomes mandatory.

But that little picture of a whirling helicopter shows one helicopter. It wont show any of the other helicopters that HAVENT taken that decision or the ones that sent an email sating dont track me to fr24.

So there's your problem, sites like FR24 can positively show there IS an aircraft in the area but they cannot say there isnt.

(Theres also the issue of it needs to be in range of an ADS-B receiver that has also decided to share data with fr24 which in rural areas is far from guaranteed).

Commercial operators have higher equipage rates than general aviation. While 76% of commercial operators have equipped their aircraft with ADS-B Out, only 44% of general aviation operators have equipped their aircraft with the technology.

Figures for Sept 2019. Its supposedly mandatory now (in the US only) but still nowhere near 100% coverage.

So to appear on your FR24 app:

(i) an aircraft needs to have ADS-B fitted. Not all do or turn it on. Theres a military exemption, GA route exemptions etc
(ii) Needs to be within range of an ADS-B receiving station. In urban areas, likely. In more rural or remote areas or mountains. Not so common. High altitude easy, low or very low much less coverage
(iii) The receiving station has to share data with FR24
(iv) That aircraft must not be on any opt-out list.

 

[Jeff A]

Here is a page that will calculate what you are asking. Heep in mind, glide paths are generally 3° but not always, and generally arrive at ground level 1000' past the threshold of the runway. Happy calculating.

Calculate the Slope

Calculate the slope in degrees and percent, the distances in length and height and the total distance.

rechneronline.de

 

[Jet skier]

Quite simply it doesn't. It only shows aircraft that have ADS-B fitted. A majority of commercial aircraft do. That isnt the case for GA aircraft, even in the states.
The FR24 block and opt out list alone runs to a few thousands aircraft even of those that DO send it.

You should go about ADS-B and the requirements. Its not a universal show-all system. And its even worse going through 3rd party data providers like FR24 you can opt out of.

I hear ya

 

[Deleted member 114292]

Well, that "knowing the pattern" is tricky as pattern horizontal is easy, but vertical is different. I was trying to understand if there is such a thing as standard approach in regards to vertical. Sounds like there is, but what if no pilots around to listen to? I need some way of estimating "am I even close" to altitude where planes would go on landing. A police officer might ask that or anyone accusing me of interfering. I sure would like to be able to say "I am at least 300' vertically away from typical traffic for this or that reason...".
That would be a good test question - you are 1 mile from a private runway, in landing approach area. How low would you expect the lowest flying plane to be?
Answers:
A) 200 ft
B) 100 ft
C) Just blame the visual observer for not telling you

But then the out cry would be "Wait, now we have to know trig too?".

 

[gnirtS]

But then the out cry would be "Wait, now we have to know trig too?".

Well in most countries you sort of "do" already. most have a distance from people or distance from buildings rule which is a straight line so in theory needs trig..

 

[sdold]

You can learn about traffic patterns here: https://www.faa.gov/documentlibrary/media/advisory_circular/ac_90-66b.pdf

The majority of traffic at most small airports is VFR and follows the traffic pattern. And once you know where it is, you can figure that the downwind leg is almost always at least 800' AGL, the turn to base is at least 500' AGL, and the turn to final is probably around 300' AGL. These will be close enough for just about any small airport. I'd recommend staying well away from runway centerline in case someone makes a straight-in approach or straight out departure.

Typical distance from the runway to the downwind leg will be about 3/4 mile to 1 mile, and the distance from the end of the runway to the point where they turn final is about the same.

 

[Bbarr]

That is a reasonable start, and I had thought of that, but I want to know what a pilot refers to. I thought I have heard pilots refer to the approach altitude charts on youtube vids. I was expecting some to comment on how complex or easy they would be to read.
I would imagine there are at least rules of thumb, such as "don't go lower than some angle or you risk being in trouble if engine fails".

I was in flight inspection. Glide paths are usually between 2.5 & 3 degrees.

 

[usaken]

OK, a little rusty on my private pilot skills but the pattern altitude is usually but not always 1000 AGL. A pilot will enter the right hand or left hand pattern about mid field, on a 45 degree angle, at pattern altitude. Then make a 45 degree turn onto the downwind leg. When they pass the runway threshold they will begin decent by reducing power and adding flaps but continuing down wind in a decent. At some point, the pilot will turn 90 degrees onto the short cross wind leg. Atmthat point they might be at 500’ agl. The final 90’ turn will bring the pilot onto the final approach upwind leg adding more flaps and reducing power. The pilot continues the decent to land the plane. That is a rough approximation of a standard approach. Everything can be different depending on many variables. A,very good Idea would be to visit the local flight school and pay for an hour of demonstrations of landings and takeoffs. Theres nothing like actually being up there and seeing just how it works.

 

[MavicFlyer]

You can learn about traffic patterns here: https://www.faa.gov/documentlibrary/media/advisory_circular/ac_90-66b.pdf

The majority of traffic at most small airports is VFR and follows the traffic pattern. And once you know where it is, you can figure that the downwind leg is almost always at least 800' AGL, the turn to base is at least 500' AGL, and the turn to final is probably around 300' AGL. These will be close enough for just about any small airport. I'd recommend staying well away from runway centerline in case someone makes a straight-in approach or straight out departure.

Typical distance from the runway to the downwind leg will be about 3/4 mile to 1 mile, and the distance from the end of the runway to the point where they turn final is about the same.

I've been out of the cockpit for almost 40 years, but things like traffic patterns haven't changed. The advisory circular you reference is a great source of info about traffic pattern operations, and includes clear graphics. To the OP, keep in mind that if you're at 400' AGL or lower, the only issues you're likely to face will be on final.