It's Getting Harder and Harder to Fly a Drone

[shb]

I'm flying illegally in a country right now. They key is to find a place where you can take off, and land, without getting seen. Once you're up at altitude, they can't see you.

 

[Big Bro]

I now am starting to select drone friendly venues over drone-agonistic countries and places to visit. It can work both ways.

Dr. D, this is the right approach. Less and less these days are the things we can do or have control over. Where we choose to spend our money is one freedom we haven't lost. Yet anyway! Be sure to let anyone you run across in your travel planning know of what you think of their drone laws and how you plan to take your drone and your money somewhere else!

 

[TonyPHX]

Government taking the fun out of all things that are beautiful. Sorry man.

 

[Dale D]

Well we need to respect fly laws in other countries just as we do here. I have no doubt tourists worldwide have done the wrong things at one time or another that has pissed off the locals.

To all on this forum and to the moderator GF- I think this is certainly on topic

This is a follow up. I received this letter in today's e-mail from one of the commercial companies in Kenya given to me by the Kenya Civil Aviation Authorities. It is breath taking in the amount of costs and regulations that now arise due to government control of drone flying. Here is the letter. I am omitting the name of the operator.

Thank you for reaching out to us with your request. For your intended drone operation, we can take two approaches as detailed below:

"1. Obtaining a ROC support service. This would entail:
- Getting a RPL licenced pilot to operate the drone. As you are already a licensed drone pilot, then your existing licence will suffice
- Importing your drone. This requires a temporary import permit charged at Ksh 20,000 from KCAA and is valid for 30 days. The drone must be insured from its country of origin and the application should be made within a month of the intended operation.
- Obtain ROC support services from Astral. Where we will have you operate under our ROC licence. This is charged at $200 - $250 a day, and we shall need to have a minder from Astral Aerial accompany you during the whole operation.This includes travel days while travel, meals, park fees and accommodation costs are borne by the client.

2. Renting a drone and drone pilot service. This would entail:
- Renting a drone (Mavic 3) and a pilot to work under our ROC licence. This is charged at $500 / day (including travel days). The cost is exclusive of travel, accommodation, meals and park fees which shall be borne by the client.

Please find a ROC support checklist with all the required documents for ROC support approval from KCAA.

I look forward to your feedback on how to proceed.

Best regards,"

I think our days of flying drones are numbered!

Dale
Miami

 

[AVLJMA]

These bans and overbearing rules are really ridiculous. Unless, of course, the Kenyan government and other countries think that Dale D is an international spy. "It's D, Dale D". I can hear the James Bond theme song playing now.

 

[loop]

Are you sure these are not rules for flying in a wild life park or something relevant?
It really does not make sense if these applied to the whole country.

 

[Chrislaf]

Why not just bring your DSLRs and save all the hassle. Yes, aerial shots give a different perspective but unless you are willing to pay the fees and abide by the restrictions you aren’t going to change anything.

There are many places I’d love to fly my drone but there are rules in place prohibiting drone flights for various reasons so I just use my DSLRs.

Chris

 

[Droning on and on...]

These bans and overbearing rules are really ridiculous. Unless, of course, the Kenyan government and other countries think that Dale D is an international spy. "It's D, Dale D". I can hear the James Bond theme song playing now.

Drone footage shaken, not stirred.

 

[Droning on and on...]

Are you sure these are not rules for flying in a wild life park or something relevant?
It really does not make sense if these applied to the whole country.

I may be why we seem to have a dearth of members from Kenya, and amateur Kenyan footage, which I expect would be spectacular, doesn't show up much on YT.

 

[Droning on and on...]

Why not just bring your DSLRs and save all the hassle. Yes, aerial shots give a different perspective but unless you are willing to pay the fees and abide by the restrictions you aren’t going to change anything.

There are many places I’d love to fly my drone but there are rules in place prohibiting drone flights for various reasons so I just use my DSLRs.

Chris

I think the crux of the discussion is "why?".

"Submit" is an obvious solution, but unreasonable rules are worth discussing.

 

[Chrislaf]

I think the crux of the discussion is "why?".

"Submit" is an obvious solution, but unreasonable rules are worth discussing.

Yes, and if you read my reply in post #13 you will have a possible reason.

It seems the authorities already provided a solution.

Chris

 

[Droning on and on...]

Yes, and if you read my reply in post #13 you will have a possible reason.

It seems the authorities already provided a solution.

Chris

So question answered, we all should stop discussing it?

Let's put something clearly to rest: I am certainly not encouraging anyone to risk breaking flight rules in any country. That is what post #13 addresses.

I, and most others are discussing the restrictive nature of these rules, disagree that they need to be that way, and are questioning the justification for these strict rules.

Your post #13 addresses none of this, but instead simply knocks down the straw man of intending to violate the rules. Dale D joked about it, and it seemed only you and one or two others, unsurprisingly, took it way too seriously.

The question stands: Why are these countries making it so hard for visitors to use drones?

 

[SethB]

These bans and overbearing rules are really ridiculous. Unless, of course, the Kenyan government and other countries think that Dale D is an international spy. "It's D, Dale D". I can hear the James Bond theme song playing now.

In my opinion it *isn’t* about Dale the potential spy.

As someone who has worked internationally, this looks like:

a) Commercial protectionism. We don’t want film production companies, stringers, or wildlife stock videographers taking jobs away from working Kenyans. (this is the one I’ve had personal experience with, though not in Africa)

Mixed with:
b) Think of all the things an uncaring drone operator might do! Horrors!

Mixed with:
c) We (the Kenyan government) determine how (imagery) resources are commercially extracted from our country in our post-colonial economy.

Mixed with:
d) An inability to distinguish between commercial uses and recreational uses of drones and drone imagery.

I don’t agree with much of the above. Dale’s proposed droning should be examined and permitted in the light of who he is and what he wants to do, not lumped in with all those commercial or hazardous operators.

There are some *very* cool things being done with longer selfie-style sticks and lightweight action cameras - such a rig would probably take less space in your luggage than a drone! Something like this:

#270Pro - BACKPACK S 3K | #270Pro

***Limited Edition*** Lighter and more durable than ever, it is steadier and easier to maneuver.Carbon fiber is made of thin, strong crystalline filaments of carbon that are used to strengthen the material. 3K model has a tow size of 3k and is woven in a twill weave. The “k” refers to a...

www.270pro.com

I think 5000 NT is about equivalent to $150 USD.

It’s an aerial-like perspective… often being used with small 360 cameras so a conventional image can later be extracted from the 360 image - shoot now, compose later.

 

[Chrislaf]

The question stands: Why are these countries making it so hard for visitors to use drones?

Part of it probably has to do with regulation and the cost of regulation. Drone laws can vary greatly from country to country. In Canada foreigners can fly a sub 250g drone as long as they follow the rules (don’t fly in National/Provincial parks etc.) and “don’t be stupid”. Any drone above 250g requires that you are Canadian citizen and have a drone pilot licence. It’s virtually impossible for a tourist to get all the documents required to fly a drone like the Mavic 3 in Canada.

The second part probably has to do with more restrictions to make it harder for those who have a total disregard for following any rules/regulations.

And third, in some countries especially in poorer countries being able to charge wealthy tourists who are willing to pay for ‘extra’ privileges to fly their drone is likely not much different than say paying a guide to take you on a personal tour of different sites of interest or locations.

Chris

 

[Torque]

There are some *very* cool things being done with longer selfie-style sticks and lightweight action cameras - such a rig would probably take less space in your luggage than a drone! Something like this:
https://www.270pro.com/product-page/270pro-backpack-s-3k I think 5000 NT is about equivalent to $150 USD.

This is much cheaper. I actually saw someone using this on the Seattle waterfront.

https://www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Lightweight-Extendable-Wireless-Compatible/dp/B074SGNWY9/ref=sr_1_9?crid=3USRPZPK12FM6&keywords=drone+selfie+stick&qid=1683909630&sprefix=drone+selfie+stick%2Caps%2C133&sr=8-9

 

[MPone]

Yes it’s going to be restrictive everywhere going forward. Most places of interest are already drone prohibited. Just bypass or don’t visit these countries altogether.

 

[tls3601]

I think the crux of the discussion is "why?".

"Submit" is an obvious solution, but unreasonable rules are worth discussing.

It’s probably like many things, a few bad apples makes it worse for everyone. Makes one realize just how many freedoms we have/had? here in the USA

 

[Michael Ainsworth]

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Just a thought....

Purchase a pocket fisherman, a helium balloon and hang a GoPro camera from it to simulate aerial flight, even though it's a tethered flight, you might get some shots?

Like I said, just a thought.

Or a kite?

 

[MAvic_South_Oz]

Are you sure these are not rules for flying in a wild life park or something relevant?
It really does not make sense if these applied to the whole country.

^^^ this . . . perhaps.

Dales reply from that drone place in red above said "For your intended drone operation . . ."

His inquiry may have stated flying on this safari, which is possibly a wildlife protection zone most likely.
Also some lodges and tour ops there are already banning drones (from Dales previous posts on African safari trips) due to keeping the peace . . . animal peace and that of other tour guests.

Who wants a drone starting up at dawn to capture an African savannah sunrise ?
Yes, I know a considerate person would walk a ways out of earshot, but that's probably banned / unadvisable given the dangers of leaving camp in such a place, and not all tourists are so thinking and considerate.

But, Kenyan drone laws seem to be restrictive as Dale points out.
A quick google indicates at least a permit is needed, but about middle of this page . . .

Additional Note for Foreign Operators​

In Kenya, drone ownership is restricted to citizens, residents, businesses, and governments. This restriction would rule out foreign tourists, leaving only the option of renting a drone locally. The law does, however, include a 30-day temporary permit that may be appropriate for travelers.

Drone Laws in Kenya [Updated April 15, 2023]
LAST UPDATED ON APRIL 15TH, 2023 AT 05:52 PM

Info there on categories operating in restricted zones requiring licensed pilot credentials.
Lots of other links in google results indicating no drone use in certain national parks.

 

[Cymruflyer]

So question answered, we all should stop discussing it?

Let's put something clearly to rest: I am certainly not encouraging anyone to risk breaking flight rules in any country. That is what post #13 addresses.

I, and most others are discussing the restrictive nature of these rules, disagree that they need to be that way, and are questioning the justification for these strict rules.

Your post #13 addresses none of this, but instead simply knocks down the straw man of intending to violate the rules. Dale D joked about it, and it seemed only you and one or two others, unsurprisingly, took it way too seriously.

The question stands: Why are these countries making it so hard for visitors to use drones?

They are not making it hard, they are just making it expensive and that is so they can earn money in any and everyway they can. These countries have a lot of corruption and I'm sure this is just another way for them to fleece those who have paid good money to come and visit their countries and will spend more in food, accommodation and souvenirs while there. Keeping up these drone tactics will mean that many and hopefully most, will choose to go somewhere else who value the tourist dollars spent.