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This is the latest news out of New York City Concerning the Flying of Drones…

LoudThunder

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City institutes rules and fees aimed at controlling drones

New York Daily News ∙ 22 Jul 2023 ∙ BY MICHAEL GARTLAND

Drone operators will have to be licensed by the feds and pay a fee under rules announced Friday by NYPD Commissioner Edward Caban and Mayor Adams (below).

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Mayor Adams is moving New York City into the drone zone, but critics fear some will be left behind. Adams and top city officials announced Friday that the city is adopting new guidelines around drones intended to make it easier to use them for building and infrastructure inspections, as well as other commercial uses.

“Drones are proven technology, and they’re being used every day,” Adams said during a press conference on the Lower East Side. “The city of New York cannot lead from the rear. We must lead from the front.”

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The new guidelines and permitting process for drones opens their use up to anyone who wants to apply to the NYPD for a $150 permit. But obtaining a permit comes with requirements, including that the drone operator have a remote pilot certificate, the guidelines for which are laid out by the Federal Aviation Administration.

“Prior to the creation of this process, if someone launched a drone within city limits, they were always, always in violation of the law,” NYPD Commissioner Edward Caban said Friday. “Now, we are creating a balance between legal access and safety for all.”

The requirements around getting a permit and the fee associated with it are likely to limit the number of people seeking to use drones for recreational purposes. But the requirements include provisions that might curb more practical applications of drones as well.

According to the city’s website, applications must be submitted to the city at least 30 days in advance of the first proposed take-off or landing — a timeframe media lawyers say precludes news outlets from using drones to cover breaking stories.

“These proposed rules totally ignore the news media,” said Robert Roth, a Brooklyn-based media lawyer.

That isn’t his only concern. Since the new guidelines aren’t enshrined through a law passed by the City Council, he’s skeptical they’d hold up in court if they were to face a legal challenge.

“It’s a great doubt in my mind, and that of many other lawyers, as to whether or not the NYPD can enact a regulation that effectively amounts to amendment of city law,” Roth said. “I don’t think they can do it.”

Officials from the Adams’ administration did not immediately respond to questions about the issues raised by Roth.

During his press conference Friday, Adams was asked a more general question about how news organizations would be allowed to use drones. He responded by pointing to the new permitting process.

“By having a website, you can see that we are utilizing the permission process in the correct way, and that’s the goal,” he said. “The goal is transparency, allowing people to take away the uncertainty.”

City officials expect contractors and private entities to submit applications for other practical uses like buildings inspections and environmental impact assessments.

The city itself is already using drones for its own inspections and assessments. And Adams has previously touted the city’s use of new technology, most notably when he pointed to use of both drones and robotic dogs in the wake of a downtown building collapse in April.

Deputy Mayor Meera Joshi ticked off several ways the city is now using the technology in other ways, including for bridge inspections conducted by the Transportation Department, facade inspections done by the Buildings Department and an assessment of the city’s tree canopy being undertaken by the Parks Department.

“There are sadly many conditions in this city where a drone inspection is the only way we’re going to be able to see the critical, dangerous fault lines that need rapid repair,” she said.

End of Story…………………..
 
REMOTE POSSIBILITIES
City institutes rules and fees aimed at controlling drones

New York Daily News ∙ 22 Jul 2023 ∙ BY MICHAEL GARTLAND



According to the city’s website, applications must be submitted to the city at least 30 days in advance of the first proposed take-off or landing — a timeframe media lawyers say precludes news outlets from using drones to cover breaking stories.

“These proposed rules totally ignore the news media,” said Robert Roth, a Brooklyn-based media lawyer.
Gee, there's a surprise. The police want to block the news media from independently video recording breaking news in the city. I wonder why they would do that?
 
Gee, there's a surprise. The police want to block the news media from independently video recording breaking news in the city. I wonder why they would do that?
Unconstitutional. unless I didn't see the exception. Wouldn't be surprised if lawsuit wasn't filed on Monday. Imagine if every big city had such a website (and permit rules).
 
If successful it also looks like it's a nice little money earner for the city. $150 a pop hop? hmmmmm
...also, pretty sure there are no refunds. So when your permit is denied or it's allowed to languish and never dealt with, the effect is you stop applying. At some point, the people are going to figure this out and will stop applying; besides, most people will fly away without a permit so there's that. This "tax" only applies to the law-abiding citizens.
 
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hahaha 150 $$……money printing machine is overheating at this point,real money has to be collected wherever is possible,next for a commercial job you will need police detail as a “obsrver”,another 150 $ 😁
 
If successful it also looks like it's a nice little money earner for the city. $150 a pop hop? hmmmmm

...also, pretty sure there are no refunds.

I first posted about this back in early June and this is quoted out of that posting…

Quote…………

The NYPD can deny any permit request it believes would “cause an unreasonable danger to the health or safety of the applicant, operator, or others, including members of the public.” Drone operators may appeal permit denials — but the $150 application fee will be non-refundable, the Police Department said.

End of Quote………….


Yeah, I believe it's just another "Money Grab…"
 
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Id say its much worse than just a money grab. A big city police department is purporting to have the executive authority to issue Police Executive Orders completely circumventing the local political and legislative process.
 
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They need the preemption guidance from the FAA..... sheesh. What a cluster.
I agree the new rules are onerous, but they're ground use rules, not airspace rules. There is no preemption here.
 
I agree the new rules are onerous, but they're ground use rules, not airspace rules. There is no preemption here.

Yes, but....

Since anything they're claiming is a danger or a nuisance is really the flight of the drone, aren't these rules really a de facto ban on flying? And thus, couldn't it be argued that they are overstepping?

For instance, what if I were to set up for a flight in Central Park but never launched. Would the police cite me?
 
Yes, but....

Since anything they're claiming is a danger or a nuisance is really the flight of the drone, aren't these rules really a de facto ban on flying? And thus, couldn't it be argued that they are overstepping?

For instance, what if I were to set up for a flight in Central Park but never launched. Would the police cite me?
Even is this is a de facto ban, it's land use. FAA has no say so.
 
There is no preemption here.
Oh, I disagree, with your use of "Preemption"…

The police department is taking it upon themselves to regulate what you do in public space. What is next, will then regulate the standing on a sidewalk watching a YouTube Video, or making a phone call, or any other imaginable thing that cops have said in the past, "Move Along, there's nothing to see here…"

What does preemption mean in law? Preemption is a legal doctrine that allows a higher level of government to limit or even. eliminate the power of a lower level of government to regulate a specific issue. Under the. Supremacy Clause of the US Constitution, federal law takes precedence over state and. local law.
 
Oh, I disagree, with your use of "Preemption"…

The police department is taking it upon themselves to regulate what you do in public space. What is next, will then regulate the standing on a sidewalk watching a YouTube Video, or making a phone call, or any other imaginable thing that cops have said in the past, "Move Along, there's nothing to see here…"

What does preemption mean in law? Preemption is a legal doctrine that allows a higher level of government to limit or even. eliminate the power of a lower level of government to regulate a specific issue. Under the. Supremacy Clause of the US Constitution, federal law takes precedence over state and. local law.
We're talking about federal preemption in the NAS. Ground regulations are not considered preempted by the FAA. Never have been. And not all Federal Law takes precedence over local law. Especially when it comes to local laws dealing with land use restrictions.

So no, there is zero federal preemption in the NYC drone regulations.

Don't take my word for it, feel free to read the brand new "State and Local Regulation of Unmanned Aircraft Systems (UAS) Fact Sheet" from the FAA. It is very clear on this matter.

 
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Oh, I disagree, with your use of "Preemption"…

The police department is taking it upon themselves to regulate what you do in public space. What is next, will then regulate the standing on a sidewalk watching a YouTube Video, or making a phone call, or any other imaginable thing that cops have said in the past, "Move Along, there's nothing to see here…"

What does preemption mean in law? Preemption is a legal doctrine that allows a higher level of government to limit or even. eliminate the power of a lower level of government to regulate a specific issue. Under the. Supremacy Clause of the US Constitution, federal law takes precedence over state and. local law.
Just to be clear:

1. Police only ENFORCE laws NOT create them. LEGISLATIVE acts create laws, codes, and ordinances at all levels.
2. NYC is a complex environment to police/protect and ensure any measure of public safety for a lot of reasons.
3. This is an ongoing and evolving process to manage risk in a very densely populated area with unique features.
4. Public safety and public access are a delicate balance often in conflict, but especially in densely populated areas.

Drone use is a new problem/solution for governments to manage effectively, and solutions will take some time to develop. UAV technology is also continuing to quickly develop and as a result the process will be dynamic and changeable with legislation often becoming dated almost as soon as it is put in place (the pace of technology exceeds that of our ability to accurately foresee a need for a regulatory environment and act on it).

These are growing pains, and we need to learn to live with them and contribute positive input for change, as interested stakeholders.

Please turn down the paranoia and increase the levels of your ability to educate, explain, demonstrate, and advocate for your right to fly whether recreationally or commercially, and understand that in some places it will just not happen.

This is a big picture issue, so please try and think more globally.
 
The problem is flying a drone is not a right. So it is true that NYC can say you cannot launch a drone from NYC public property. Not so sure they can say that about private property but that's not the issue here. It's the permit process. NYC has a long sordid history of requiring a permit for an activity, not to regulate it or control it, but in order to prohibit it. As was mentioned earlier, NYC cannot pass an ordinance that says no drone can take-off or land anywhere in the NY city limits 24/7. But this process is a defacto ban because they'll never issue a single permit or maybe they issue one or two permits to make it viable.

We've faced this before. Unfortunately they'll probably get away with it because flying a drone is not something a city resident is entitled to do. However, where NYC will face problems, I mentioned earlier, the press will never be able to properly fly a drone to gather news and other public interest because there is no exception in this process and the government can pick and choose who gets a permit and when and where and even then, it's not timely. As far as I know, this is per incident, no monthly or yearly. Still, if you can issue a permit, you can revoke it or suspend. Or you can raise the price to $2,000. No government should have that kind of power over the free press. Before anyone says the press doesn't need to fly drones to effectively report the news....that's not the point.
 
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There is a bit of conflict here...the original ban is on launching, landing and controlling a drone from within the City....from what I have been able to dig up that ban is law imposed through the proper channels necessary to create a law in NYC....the PD does not have the authority to issue permits to do something that is illegal or otherwise come up with their own regulations...the law banning drones has not been struck down and remains in effect...this will wind up in court and the PD will be over ruled.....that being said, I have to comment that the photos and videos that could be obtained would be world class....however the sheer number of people in NYC and the inconsiderate and dangerous things that drone operators do pose too much of a hazard to allow flying drones in NYC
 
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There is a bit of conflict here...the original ban is on launching, landing and controlling a drone from within the City....from what I have been able to dig up that ban is law imposed through the proper channels necessary to create a law in NYC....the PD does not have the authority to issue permits to do something that is illegal or otherwise come up with their own regulations...the law banning drones has not been struck down and remains in effect...this will wind up in court and the PD will be over ruled.....that being said, I have to comment that the photos and videos that could be obtained would be world class....however the sheer number of people in NYC and the inconsiderate and dangerous things that drone operators do pose too much of a haard to allow flying drones in NYC
Dangerous how so? As in killing/injury people or extensive damage to property?

Are you taking a runaway speed truck thru the city streets or a 250g DJI Mini 2?

So NYC is different then let's say Chicago where you fly all over that city, huh? :mad:

Who's side are you on? :)
 
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