Thought experiment - Are professional fireworks operators drone pilots?

[mavictk]

I was looking at Florida law and a drone is defined as:

934.50 Searches and seizure using a drone.—
(1) SHORT TITLE.—This act may be cited as the “Freedom from Unwarranted Surveillance Act.”
(2) DEFINITIONS.—As used in this act, the term:
(a) “Drone” means a powered, aerial vehicle that:
1. Does not carry a human operator;
2. Uses aerodynamic forces to provide vehicle lift;
3. Can fly autonomously or be piloted remotely;
4. Can be expendable or recoverable; and
5. Can carry a lethal or nonlethal payload.

Are aerial fireworks drones and do their operators need part 107 licensing for professional shows? Again, this is a thought experiment so analyze the five elements above.

To me I am unsure whether an aerial firework uses aerodynamic forces as per (2)(a) 2 above.

Additionally, Florida law is not binding on the FAA therefore if Florida calls something a drone the relevant FAA rules may not apply.

Thoughts please.

 

[FLDave]

You need to first find the definition of a "powered, aerial vehicle". I don't suppose that included fireworks.

 

[Ty Pilot]

Nope

It might be simpler to ask a certified fireworks tech if he has to have a 107. The Answer will be "NO" but they do have to have a pyrotechnics license.

 

[mavictk]

You need to first find the definition of a "powered, aerial vehicle". I don't suppose that included fireworks.

Powered like a rocket is powered. I used the word aerial to indicate fire works that are airborne.

 

[mavictk]

Nope

It might be simpler to ask a certified fireworks tech if he has to have a 107. The Answer will be "NO" but they do have to have a pyrotechnics license.

Nope? Which criteria do you think doesn’t apply?

 

[mavictk]

My reason for calling this a thought experiment is that in my old age I am learning why courts have to interpret laws because the legislature is bad at writing them. Please continue with the thought experiment.

 

[Ty Pilot]

Powered like a rocket is powered. I used the word aerial to indicate fire works that are airborne.

Okay I'll play along.

A Rocket takes it's engine and fuel with it
A Firework has no means of propulsion or lift on board. (I am speaking of commercial fireworks by the way - not consumer grade)

A Firework is nothing like a rocket

 

[Cafguy]

Those drone fireworks displays are done with small drones and really bright lighting I am pretty sure they are programmed in python or such and controlled by a computer some of those drones are pretty much one use only things.

 

[Torque]

A Firework is nothing like a rocket

A Hobbyist Model Rocket is sort of like a Firework. They just don't carry a colorful exploding payload. Some of the Estes brand model rockets can reach 3,000 ft AGL - you know, the ones the school kids (and the kid in me) often launch - no certification needed.
There is no guidance system on these rockets, nor on fireworks.

 

[Ty Pilot]

A Hobbyist Model Rocket is sort of like a Firework. They just don't carry a colorful exploding payload. Some of the Estes brand model rockets can reach 3,000 ft AGL - you know, the ones the school kids (and the kid in me) often launch - no certification needed.
There is no guidance system on these rockets, nor on fireworks.

Yes but he specifically called out "Professional Fireworks" in the title.

 

[Cafguy]

I thought the operator was talking about "fireworks" displays Not the actually fireworks but the drones used to create these displays. The drones are not fireworks they are drones with leds on them like this:
and yes because they are making huge bucks they are 107 cert and I am sure they cross all their Tees and dot their I s

 

[mavictk]

Those drone fireworks displays are done with small drones and really bright lighting I am pretty sure they are programmed in python or such and controlled by a computer some of those drones are pretty much one use only things.

Oops, clarification. I really didn't mean for actually drones to be included in the discussion.

 

[Torque]

Yes but he specifically called out "Professional Fireworks" in the title.

Google tells me that Professional Firworks often reach altitudes of 1000 ft. Google also told me that model rockets can reach 3 times that altitude.
Neither meets the requirements listed above that would require a part 107 certification to launch either.
No certification at all for Model Rockets,
But every state requires a Pyrotech to be certified. Here in Washington they have to go through training with the Fire Marshall and pass a test. My sister in Colorado maintained her pyrotechnician's certification for many years. She was required to take a class and then set for an exam. But no 107 - there is no quidance system in either model rockets or fireworks.

 

[mavictk]

Okay I'll play along.

A Rocket takes it's engine and fuel with it
A Firework has no means of propulsion or lift on board. (I am speaking of commercial fireworks by the way - not consumer grade)

A Firework is nothing like a rocket

A bottle rocket carries its propulsion on board, right?

 

[mavictk]

A Hobbyist Model Rocket is sort of like a Firework. They just don't carry a colorful exploding payload. Some of the Estes brand model rockets can reach 3,000 ft AGL - you know, the ones the school kids (and the kid in me) often launch - no certification needed.
There is no guidance system on these rockets, nor on fireworks.

So, which of the five criteria do these rockets not meet?

 

[mavictk]

Maybe I am being overly specific but I am trying my thought experiment against the actual definition of a drone in the Florida law.

 

[Ty Pilot]

A bottle rocket carries its propulsion on board, right?

Not a "professional firework"

 

[Ty Pilot]

Nope? Which criteria do you think doesn’t apply?

Professional grade fireworks are more akin to projectiles shot from a gun.


2] Professional Fireworks have no means to produce lift - they are shot into the sky by a charge that stays on the ground.
3] Professional Fireworks cannot be piloted remotely
5] Professional Fireworks carry no payload - they are the payload - after the 'mission' nothing is left - they are not aircraft of any sort, they are an explosive charge, which is why they don't require 107s but do require a "Pyrotechnics License"

 

[Cafguy]

Sorry for that lol I understand the question now. In California there are 2 types of fireworks "consumer" and "Display" Display fireworks can only be used and sold to or by an individual licensed and permitted to use them in the area they are to be used.
They are considered "fireworks so you don't need a pilot. The one operating the firework is not a pilot and their actions aren't governed by the F.A.A. but the A.T.F. and others.

 

[mavictk]

Professional grade fireworks are more akin to projectiles shot from a gun.


2] Professional Fireworks have no means to produce lift - they are shot into the sky by a charge that stays on the ground.
3] Professional Fireworks cannot be piloted remotely
5] Professional Fireworks carry no payload - they are the payload - after the 'mission' nothing is left - they are not aircraft of any sort, they are an explosive charge, which is why they don't require 107s but do require a "Pyrotechnics License"

#2 - agreed. I now have a reason to carefully watch a fireworks show.
#3 - can fly autonomously is also a criteria.
#5 - I would suggest the explosion is the payload before it explodes.

BTW even though I gave opinions on #3 and #5 it only takes on criteria to be unmet like #2.