Last bets regarding image quality vs 2S and Mavic 3

[test2000Anafi]

Here is my 2-cent worth of thought, since Mini 3 officially is not available to public and therefore, much of this discussion is hypothetical:

Mini 3 Pro is likely not to have better image than Mavic 3 but might be about similar to Air2S (maybe less). Why? DJI has to still have good reasons to have people buy Air2S and the Mavic 3 in terms of money. If the Mini 3 Pro was going to be better image quality, than people would buy Mini 3 Pro over the Air2s and Mavic 3. In that case, with the current hypothetical price of Mini 3 Pro, DJI would lose money. It needs to be equivalent or likely less image quality, in order for DJI to continue to make money off the Air2S and Mavic 3.

I agree, also better than mavic 3 might be physically impossible regarding the sensor. However, air2s is more than a year old. If they really cared for it, they would not have made the 3 pro as amazing as it is. They would have put in f2 with a 3 year old sensor, added a useless gimbal roof to obstruct the camera, and so on

 

[EpicFlight]

Mini 3 Pro is likely not to have better image than Mavic 3 but might be about similar to Air2S (maybe less). Why? DJI has to still have good reasons to have people buy Air2S and the Mavic 3 in terms of money. If the Mini 3 Pro was going to be better image quality, than people would buy Mini 3 Pro over the Air2s and Mavic 3. In that case, with the current hypothetical price of Mini 3 Pro, DJI would lose money. It needs to be equivalent or likely less image quality, in order for DJI to continue to make money off the Air2S and Mavic 3.

This isn't the product line problem you think. We're all operating in ignorance.

IF the Mini 3 is comparable or better, I'd be shocked there aren't already plans, and likely engineering well along, to refresh the M3P with a new model, for sake of example maybe the Mavic 3 Platinum, with a new camera that blows the Mini 3 out of the Solar System.

That's a lot easier an quicker to do than a whole new model.The A2S is another, somewhat more extensive example.

Keep an eye out. I forecast a fall announcement, based on nothing more than 8 years as a DJI customer.

 

[test2000Anafi]

This isn't the product line problem you think. We're all operating in ignorance.

IF the Mini 3 is comparable or better, I'd be shocked there aren't already plans, and likely engineering well along, to refresh the M3P with a new model, for sake of example maybe the Mavic 3 Platinum, with a new camera that blows the Mini 3 out of the Solar System.

That's a lot easier an quicker to do than a whole new model.The A2S is another, somewhat more extensive example.

Keep an eye out. I forecast a fall announcement, based on nothing more than 8 years as a DJI customer.

Use the same sensor as mini 3pro, move the gimbal up a little bit so that it sits between the obstacle avoidance sensors and is no more limited by the roof and *bam* air2s is now a better drone than mini 3 pro and can be called air3.

the mavic 3 successor should have a changeable gimbal like autel IMO, but you are right they have already planned a few things, plus different teams working in parallel on different products and so on

 

[EsaT]

The one with dual ISO is favoured is what you are saying? Everything else being identical.

Quad Bayer isn't dual ISO, but just four small pixels in place of one bigger.
Dual ISO needs more complex/extra pixel level circuitry.

But f1.7 is enough brighter lens than f2.8 to more than compensate smaller sensor size.
About f2.3 would compensate for sensor area difference and rest goes above Air 2S, which didn't improve lens focal ratio from Air 2 but just sensor size.
(Four Thirds sensor in Mavic 3 again has 220% more area than Mini 3's sensor)

 

[EpicFlight]

 

[test2000Anafi]

But f1.7 is enough brighter lens than f2.8 to more than compensate smaller sensor size.
About f2.3 would compensate for sensor area difference and rest goes above Air 2S, which didn't improve lens focal ratio from Air 2 but just sensor size.

Unless DJI purposefully choosing a sensor with worse capabilities, mini 3 pro was always going to have much better low light capabilities and less noise compared to Air2s. People like you, with photography knowledge knew this the second the specs got confirmed.

the bigger sensor in this case, means nothing. Nano+ demonstrated that last year already.

the quad bayer configuration does allow for dual iso implementation without loss of Color information, would you agree?

 

[test2000Anafi]

I think the only "last bets" (as in thread title) we should be taking is IF this thing actually appears on May 10. Doesn't DJI usually have a teaser on their website for "something new" at least week before as in A 2S? n That would be tomorrow.

I bought one, and the videos are all released

 

[test2000Anafi]

Looks like I was right and most of you, of not all of you, were wrong, this is one of the first comparisons:

 

[jedi2155]

As I wrote in the other thread, that show cases the value of the 48 MP (quad bayer) image quality over the 20 MP sensor on the Air 2S. A screen cap from video at the same resolution would be much more interesting (4K60 on both drones) and would be a proper comparison.

 

[boldblue737]

There are direct comparison shots between Mavic 3 and Mini 3 Pro in this review and in low light conditions as you’d expect the Mini 3 Pro gets crushed. Low light will not outperform Air 2S or Mavic 3 on this drone.

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[Skyryder]

Hmm, I have my doubts about those side by side picks, it's pretty hard to fly 2 different drones into the exact same spot like that. Variation of just a foot, or small breeze could skew the results. Really the only way to test them is on a fixed surface or structure. To me the second pic with the Air 2s looks better than the right. Especially in the shadows all along the right side of the photo.

 

[test2000Anafi]

DJI Mini 3 Pro Review: Better than the Air 2S? - Pilot Institute

The competition for the sub-250 gram drones is getting fierce! With this latest release, DJI is going heads on with Autel and its Nano series. For the first time, we are seeing obstacle avoidance sensors in a Mini. We also get new intelligent flight modes taken directly from the Air and Pro...

pilotinstitute.com

it is better than air2s; sharper video with more detail, and better pictures as well

 

[jedi2155]

There are direct comparison shots between Mavic 3 and Mini 3 Pro in this review and in low light conditions as you’d expect the Mini 3 Pro gets crushed. Low light will not outperform Air 2S or Mavic 3 on this drone.

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That's a great video showing two issues with the Mini 3 Pro.

1. Reduced Dynamic Range compared to the higher end models. The Mini 3 has terrible dynamic range compared to the Mavic 3. I recall how much I LOVED the dynamic range on my Air 2S, and in many of the videos / examples i've seen on the Mini 3, the Dynamic range looks really compressed.
2. The wider aperture on the Mini 3 is going to cause real big problems with too much sharpness in high light scenarios because it'll be running on a much faster shutter speed to prevent it from blowing out. This was seen in the beach shot compared to the Mavic 3 where the Mavic feels lot smoother (pay attention the waves and trees on the video). The Mini 3 absolutely will need some ND filters during the day.

I think the Mini 3 will be trading improved Low Light capability, at the loss of dynamic range due to the really fast aperture of F/1.7 compared to the F/2.8 on the Air 2S.

This was one of my very first drone photos on the Air 2S and was blown away by the dynamic range here with no ND filter.

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[Meta4]

This was one of my very first drone photos on the Air 2S and was blown away by the dynamic range here with no ND filter.

Not sure why you specifically mentioned the filter, but an ND filter won't do anything to change the dynamic range of a camera.
Unless you have a particular reason to want to force a slower shutter speed than otherwise possible, there's no reason to use an ND filter for shooting stills with your drone.

 

[jedi2155]

Not sure why you specifically mentioned the filter, but an ND filter won't do anything to change the dynamic range of a camera.
Unless you have a particular reason to want to force a slower shutter speed than otherwise possible, there's no reason to use an ND filter for shooting stills with your drone.

I wasn't referring to stills but video capture. The ND filter will still impact the stills, for example if you want use hyperlapse where you can reduce the shutter speed on stills to capture different impacts.
Example here:

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[Skyryder]

Mini 3 look like it is

Looks like I was right and most of you, of not all of you, were wrong, this is one of the first comparisons:

View attachment 148095View attachment 148096View attachment 148097

But in a still test in a controlled environment it looks like the Mini 3 has more noise in the color.

 

[test2000Anafi]

Mini 3 look like it is



But in a still test in a controlled environment it looks like the Mini 3 has more noise in the color.

View attachment 148117

That is what it looks like to you, but this is not their conclusion at all

 

[test2000Anafi]

Hmm, I have my doubts about those side by side picks, it's pretty hard to fly 2 different drones into the exact same spot like that. Variation of just a foot, or small breeze could skew the results. Really the only way to test them is on a fixed surface or structure. To me the second pic with the Air 2s looks better than the right. Especially in the shadows all along the right side of the photo.

In the real review they did exactly that; mount the drones side by side under a bigger drone

 

[jedi2155]

I downloaded the full resolution comparisons between the Mini 3 Pro and the Air 2S and there's something werid going on where the Air 2S pictures are really fuzzy/blurry.

Mini3Pro-Air2S-ISO200-3.jpeg

Shared with Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

It's like the Air 2S was not stable when this picture was taken. The bottom central disc is completely out of focus as well as the top right IC board.

 

[jedi2155]

I thought this is a good comparison of the sharpness on the Mini 3 Pro vs. Air 2S. Mini 3 Pro definitely sharper even with video, but the center picture feels more natural. Mini 2 is super blue and terrible dyanmic range. Mini 3 is almost as good as the Air 2S especially when you look at the browns vs. grays but there is still a bit of a blue overcast on the Mini 3 Pro compared to the warmer Air 2S.