Maybe Good to know before you register your drone..maybe

[BigRey]

If you plan on getting your part 107.
You can just register there as opposed to going through 336 and then re-registering and repaying .
The $5 per drone isn’t the real issue it’s that you will then be given new registration numbers for your drones.
Just something I thought I’d throw out there.

 

[brett8883]

If you plan on getting your part 107.
You can just register there as opposed to going through 336 and then re-registering and repaying .
The $5 per drone isn’t the real issue it’s that you will then be given new registration numbers for your drones.
Just something I thought I’d throw out there.

So brings up a point I ran into the other day wondering if anybody has insight on this. I was flying with a friend in a national forest and a forest ranger stopped us and though we were both flying for recreational purposes my drone is registered under 336 and his is registered under 107.

Because my drone was registered as a recreational vehicle I was told to “carry on.” However because my friends drone was registered as a comercial aircraft he was given a ticket for not having a permit to opperate a comercial vehicle on US Forest Service land.

We both thought it was hellas weird but does anybody know if you are a 107 Pilot can you fly your drone with 107 registration for recreation but be subject to 336 regulations if you are just flying for recreation or do you need to have an additional 336 registration to be subject to 336 rules?

 

[BigRey]

So brings up a point I ran into the other day wondering if anybody has insight on this. I was flying with a friend in a national forest and a forest ranger stopped us and though we were both flying for recreational purposes my drone is registered under 336 and his is registered under 107.

Because my drone was registered as a recreational vehicle I was told to “carry on.” However because my friends drone was registered as a comercial aircraft he was given a ticket for not having a permit to opperate a comercial vehicle on US Forest Service land.

We both thought it was hellas weird but does anybody know if you are a 107 Pilot can you fly your drone with 107 registration for recreation but be subject to 336 regulations if you are just flying for recreation or do you need to have an additional 336 registration to be subject to 336 rules?

Well Hello Can of works I’ll definitely be looking into this

 

[Bigbird48]

as far as everything I read here you can be 107 but fly as a recreational flyer and not commercial . I think if your friend just said I'm flying under 336 he should have been fine. Maybe the ranger just doesn't know the rules please keep us updated as to the results of the ticket.

 

[53-63-6f-74-74]

So brings up a point I ran into the other day wondering if anybody has insight on this. I was flying with a friend in a national forest and a forest ranger stopped us and though we were both flying for recreational purposes my drone is registered under 336 and his is registered under 107.

Because my drone was registered as a recreational vehicle I was told to “carry on.” However because my friends drone was registered as a comercial aircraft he was given a ticket for not having a permit to opperate a comercial vehicle on US Forest Service land.

We both thought it was hellas weird but does anybody know if you are a 107 Pilot can you fly your drone with 107 registration for recreation but be subject to 336 regulations if you are just flying for recreation or do you need to have an additional 336 registration to be subject to 336 rules?

This is something I have not heard of before, or even considered. Of course a Part 107 Pilot can fly for recreation using a 107 registered AC, but that is not what the ticket was for. The ticket was for having the actual AC registered as commercial and being used on USFS lands. I'm skeptical that this would hold up, but who knows? You'd have to put some time and expense into fighting it and it might not be worth it. FYI, under the 336 registration you do NOT register your drone, you register yourself and place YOUR number on the drone(s).

 

[brett8883]

This is something I have not heard of before, or even considered. Of course a Part 107 Pilot can fly for recreation using a 107 registered AC, but that is not what the ticket was for. The ticket was for having the actual AC registered as commercial and being used on USFS lands. I'm skeptical that this would hold up, but who knows? You'd have to put some time and expense into fighting it and it might not be worth it. FYI, under the 336 registration you do NOT register your drone, you register yourself and place YOUR number on the drone(s).

Yea I guess when I said “friend” what I really meant was “some guy I met because we both found this same place which was a good spot for flying and we got talking” so I’m not gonna find out the conclusion to this case.

I think maybe the better question is if the pilot is registered with 336 and the drone is registered with 107 does this mean a 107 pilot is not covered by 336 if he/she doesn’t have a 336 registration?

Should a 107 pilot just additionally register as a 336 to avoid this confusion as a matter of good practice? If flying for recreation with a drone registered as 107 should the pilot cover the 107 registration # with the 336 registration#?

 

[BD0G]

Everything I have read appears to allow one to choose if they are flying as a hobbyist even if Part 107 Certified. If the flight is conducted as a hobbyist then no ticket able offence would have been created in your situation.

 

[tleedom]

So brings up a point I ran into the other day wondering if anybody has insight on this. I was flying with a friend in a national forest and a forest ranger stopped us and though we were both flying for recreational purposes my drone is registered under 336 and his is registered under 107.

Because my drone was registered as a recreational vehicle I was told to “carry on.” However because my friends drone was registered as a comercial aircraft he was given a ticket for not having a permit to opperate a comercial vehicle on US Forest Service land.

We both thought it was hellas weird but does anybody know if you are a 107 Pilot can you fly your drone with 107 registration for recreation but be subject to 336 regulations if you are just flying for recreation or do you need to have an additional 336 registration to be subject to 336 rules?

This is why I carry a copy of the US Forestry Service UAS policy with me when I'm flying. Don't have a link right now, but they have a section specifically on UAS operations.

 

[kadras]

Here are the US Forest Service UAS links:
Tips for Responsible Hobby or Recreational Use of Unmanned Aircraft Systems (UAS) or "Drones" on National Forest Systems Lands | US Forest Service
Unmanned Aircraft Systems | US Forest Service
Downloadable FAQs: https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/fseprd523225.pdf

This is an interesting situation. The Forest Service clearly requires a permit for any commercial actviity in the forests and clearly allows recreational flying. The ability to fly recreationally even though the UAS is registered as 107 ("commercial") is no clearer to the typical ranger than it seems to be to many of the flyers on this forum. The USFS guidelines listed above provide no clarification.

I'm aware of a similar situation in a National Forest. I was flying 336 in the forest when a couple of state wildlife officers came by on routine patrol. They said they hoped I had my permit with me because they got stopped by a forest ranger who asked to see their permit while they were flying on duty. Since I wasn't flying 107 I didn't ask them what happened. And they didn't ask me any questions since my flying was of no concern to them.

 

[53-63-6f-74-74]

Everything I have read appears to allow one to choose if they are flying as a hobbyist even if Part 107 Certified. If the flight is conducted as a hobbyist then no ticket able offence would have been created in your situation.

I agree. If the flight is non-commercial then there should have been no ticket. It would be irrelevant whether or not the AC is registered under Part 107 because that still allows for recreational flights. The pilot chooses whether or not the flight is commercial, not the aircraft. The USFS docs do not provide any specificity other than needing a permit for commercial work. The home page of the FAA DroneZone says that Part 107 registration is for "recreational, commercial, governmental, or other purposes".

 

[dawgpilot]

Ranger seems very confused. Strictly speaking, the Part 107 rules aren't even "commercial" according to the law itself. You can be flying for "fun" even under a Part 107 registration and rules. You just aren't allowed to fly for commercial purposes under 336 rules.

 

[brett8883]

I appreciate everybody’s input on this! I’ve put in a request to the USFS for clarification which I will share with the group when I receive. I think everyone is in agreement here that a 107 pilot should not need a 336 registration but hopefully my request will serve the purpose of getting the information “from the horse’s mouth” so to speak, or at least make the USFS aware that there is still confusion within their ranks about the rule.

 

[Willie14228]

So brings up a point I ran into the other day wondering if anybody has insight on this. I was flying with a friend in a national forest and a forest ranger stopped us and though we were both flying for recreational purposes my drone is registered under 336 and his is registered under 107.

Because my drone was registered as a recreational vehicle I was told to “carry on.” However because my friends drone was registered as a comercial aircraft he was given a ticket for not having a permit to opperate a comercial vehicle on US Forest Service land.

We both thought it was hellas weird but does anybody know if you are a 107 Pilot can you fly your drone with 107 registration for recreation but be subject to 336 regulations if you are just flying for recreation or do you need to have an additional 336 registration to be subject to 336 rules?

I've run into this very same situation as a truck driver / Owner Operator, there are parks that do not allow commercial vehicles and even with a federal logbook showing I was off duty and using the truck as a personal vehicle was fined and it stuck.
This is exactly one of the points I tried to make on another post about hobbyist getting a 107 thinking it will give them more ley way on flight restrictions.

 

[BigRey]

I've run into this very same situation as a truck driver / Owner Operator, there are parks that do not allow commercial vehicles and even with a federal logbook showing I was off duty and using the truck as a personal vehicle was fined and it stuck.
This is exactly one of the points I tried to make on another post about hobbyist getting a 107 thinking it will give them more ley way on flight restrictions.

Well Valid point if you aren’t using it commercially no need to get licensed but with Trucks it’s a trickier situation...In NY if is commercial the vehicle is commercial and that’s that it’s not attached to your license
In this situation for instance the individual is a licensed sUAS pilot not necessarily using a drone commercially

 

[Oconnb910]

Flying UAS for fun in National Forest:
Flying UAS for Fun on National Forest System Lands | US Forest Service

 

[theDRONEranger]

Do I need permission from the FAA to fly a UAS or drone for recreation or as a hobby?


There are two ways for recreational or hobby UAS or drone fliers to operate in the National Airspace System in accordance with the law and/or FAA regulations
Option #1. Fly in accordance with the Special Rule for Model Aircraft. Under this rule, operators must:

1. Register your drone or UAS with the FAA
2. Fly for hobby or recreational purposes only
3. Follow a community-based set of safety guidelines
4. Fly your drone within visual line-of-sight
5. Give way to manned aircraft
6. Provide prior notification to the airport and air traffic control tower, if one is present, when flying within 5 miles of an airport
7. Fly a drone or UAS that weigh no more than 55 lbs. unless certified by a community-based organization

Option #2. Fly under the FAA's Small UAS Rule (14 CFR part 107). Under this rule, operators must:

1. Register their drone or UAS with the FAA as a "non-modeler" <<<<<non-modeler
2. Obtain an FAA Remote Pilot Certificate
3. Follow the operational requirements (PDF) of Part 107

 

[AMann]

This is why I carry a copy of the US Forestry Service UAS policy with me when I'm flying. Don't have a link right now, but they have a section specifically on UAS operations.

The issue for a commercial vs. recreational use on US Forest Service lands may include what will any photography taken on the forest be used for? If it will be sold, then the use of a drone is commercial even though the original intent is to be there for fun. I used to be a FS employee and wrote tickets for other commercial users working there without proper permits, but they were running a tour business that included climbing classes advertised at a sporting goods store. Pretty blatant commercial use! Anyways, as for the OP, sounds like someone just didn’t understand that 107 holders can fly recreationally, or they did not like drones and wanted to give them a bad day, or perhaps the pilot wasngiving a bad attitude to the FS employee. Who knows? I wonder what transpired before the ticket? Was the pilot polite or did they not “pass the attitude test”? FS LEO’s do have discretion on wether to ticket or not, depending on how serious the transgression, but they will usually write one if the RP is not respectful.

People make mistakes, even Forest Rangers, so if someone gets an unfair ticket like that, they are usually given a notice to appear at a Federal Magistrates office or pay a fine. The magistrates office may be rather far and sometimes it’s worth to pay the fine instead of missing work and driving a long way. If you really feel it’s unfair, take it to the District Ranger’s office and very politely discuss it with them, but email them first and make an appointment . You may get the ticket voided and not have to appear at the magistrates office.

 

[Willie14228]

Flying UAS for fun in National Forest:
Flying UAS for Fun on National Forest System Lands | US Forest Service

Great link thank you

 

[Thomas B]

Flying UAS for fun in National Forest:
Flying UAS for Fun on National Forest System Lands | US Forest Service

Great resource. Thx for posting!

 

[brett8883]

Still no response from FS will keep ya updated. Again the website is pretty clear but I’d like someone from the FS to say it with some specificity so we might have something to show in case this happens again. I hope they answer what they consider a “comercial vehicle” and if a “comercial vehicle” can be used for “recreation.”