Oh boy... we are all flying spy drones! DHS warns of 'strong concerns'

[MavicFT1P]

Go ahead and read "The Hundred Year Marathon" and then review that statement.

No

 

[simsurf]

If you live in the US I would be more worried about your own government spying on you. Snowden.

 

[PunaPhantom]

0200 Beijing time. Sirens go off in a Chinese bunker. The crew scrambles from their beds and gathers quickly in the central command room.
A message pops up on an overly large screen.

Downloading Sensitive Flight Data...
95% Completed
100% Completed
Generating report... Done.

The personnel clenches their cheeks, ready for the worst. Finally, a computerized AI voice announces through a loudspeaker:

"Declare national emergency. Joe has crashed his Syma in the backyard again."

Exactly the the trillions upon trillions of bits and bytes would be monumental and totally unusable to try to glean out any useful info... absurd... just another scare tactic that this govt uses to keep the populace under their control...

 

[Baba Narr]

Oh man! I'm threatening US national security by giving away data to China. Soon they'll know all the best places to shoot sunsets over the deserts, mountains and lakes near me. I suppose this is a more legit concern for flyers who aren't hobbyists like me. I'm sure the media will have a heyday though. Must be Monday.

Just like the UK, paranoid press cook up fantastic story's about drones spying on every thing and everyone.. HA HA welcome to 1984.. bring it on..

 

[MavicFT1P]

Exactly the the trillions upon trillions of bits and bytes would be monumental and totally unusable to try to glean out any useful info... absurd... just another scare tactic that this govt uses to keep the populace under their control...

Yes, the Government does keep the populace under control. It would be a crap form of govenment if it didnt.

If you want to huddle and Hummp like a Bonobo, you need to move to Sweeden, Norway Perhaps

 

[PropSpin]

Exactly the the trillions upon trillions of bits and bytes would be monumental and totally unusable to try to glean out any useful info... absurd... just another scare tactic that this govt uses to keep the populace under their control...

I think this is a prime example of the naivety that I'm talking about. I think it's safe to say that you have no idea of the methods at their disposal to home in on anything that might be of interest to them - of which are made available through their products and subsequent exposure in foreign countries. You also don't have any idea of what they might be looking for - something seemingly innocent could be indicative of some larger event of interest two or three times removed.

Anyway, AI is making things possible that was only science fiction a few years ago. And yes, we should be concerned about the data our own government and companies collect on us.

Samsung deepfake AI could fabricate a video of you from a single profile pic

Even the Mona Lisa can be faked.

www.cnet.com

And to respond to one of the recent posts - no, China is not a friend of the US.

 

[Former Member]

LOL, then perhaps the USA should quit being the 800 pound rabid gorilla stomping on anything not acquiescing instantly to any whim or demand of its protected corporations.
Then the world will stop building 800 pound gorilla missiles.

Reality is countries government arm against the biggest most dangerous aggressor... and the entire world has.

If the USA is the 800 pound gorilla, then the Peoples Republic of China is the 10,000 pound Panda (just not as friendly and benign as a panda.)

 

[Former Member]

Yup I agree, this is all part of the trade war dust. Things are opening up for trade with Japan now, I wonder if they have any decent drones?

PLEASE let it be so!

Kyosho, Futaba, JR just to name a few.

 

[Meta4]

What is crap? Please explain. Who's to know whether you agree with the author and are stating that DJI's behavior is crap or that the article is crap. I would assume the latter. If so, what about the article is "crap".

I think everyone that is dismissive about security risks from DJI, their product, and their involvement in the US are being naive. Rationalizing it as "look at all of the other data collection activities by other IT companies" and "who cares about my pictures/videos" doesn't excuse risk associated with DJI and their products. If I were a foreign government, I would LOVE to have the product deployment and general access into another country that DJI has. It's a no-brainer.

A lot of the responses in this thread show very little brain power being applied to consider the issue.
If you want to take this seriously, there are several points you need to think about a bit more.
1. There's a big assumption that DJI is somehow getting your photos and videos. - They aren't.
2. Who really thinks that anything they have photographed or shot video of is going to be of any strategic importance to anyone? Really?
Just look through a few hundred pix and videos here: Dronestagram | The #1 drone photography platform to get an idea how ridiculous the idea is.
3. Can you imagine being DJI's spymaster and going through al the millions of photos and videos looking for something of value? How much wasted time and effort would that take?
4. If China is really interested in seeing things in your area, they can send agents posing as tourists and visit the areas themselves.
They could fly their own drones, focusing on what they are really interested in or fly light aircraft to get good views.
Looking at a million random photos of things they have no interest in on the chance that someone has good imagery of something of strategic interest is laughable.
5. The vague DHS warning says that Chinese drones could steal valuable personal data. What valuable personal data does your drone have access to?
Why doesn't the DHS warn about Chinese made phones which have access to much more data than your drone does?

 

[Meta4]

I agree, being a relative neophyte with DJI smart drones as well, the only way I believe to prevent the data is to fly in ATTI mode which doesn't use the sensors and doesn't need the DJI application. Basically fly only using the controller in sport mode. This is not easy for a beginner since it requires advanced RC piloting skills similar to trying to fly an RC helicopter. Another option is to use a dumb drone with barometric sensors for altitude hold and GPS for position hold in wind.

If there really was any cybersecurity concern (I don't believe there is), flying in atti mode wouldn't make a shred of difference.
In atti mode your drone still uses all the same sensors and records GPS position data every 1/10th of a second.
The only difference is that the drone doesn't use the GPS data for horizontal position holding and can drift with the wind.
If you want to keep your precious data secure, flying in atti mode is not the answer.

If you want to fly without the app, good luck to you.
That would be as productive as driving blindfolded.
Not many users would want to geing able to see what the drone sees and the telemetry.

 

[Clipper707]

From a different POV (Norway), - the DHS initiative against DJI, - not to mention the ban of Huawei products, - is nothing less than parts of the trade war between USA and China. Sorry for that!

Not sure what you mean by "nothing less" but I'll concede it's part of the trade war. That doesn't mean security risks aren't real.

I worked for Huawei on a 6 month contract back in early 2015. Their products were banned by the US Government for security risks. Department of Defense and defense contractors (Boeing, Lockheed, Raytheon, etc.) were not allowed to use Huawei's networking equipment.

I began researching the company on my own. I believe they did indeed steal source code from Cisco and also believe the US Government's security concerns are justified. Huawei's founder is an ex-People's Liberation Army officer; I have no doubts where his loyalties lie.

The Chinese government and its corporations don't have the same divide ours do in the US.

I could not in good conscience continue to work for Huawei and chose not to renew my contract.

 

[Former Member]

The Chinese government and its corporations don't have the same divide ours do in the US.

How much would you speculate the Chinese government influences, runs or interferes with most Chinese companies?

Do American owned companies with Chinese facilities have a degree of autonomy?

 

[DoomMeister]

It's going to be hard given how 99.9% of population doesn't even know what a TCP stack is.

Isn’t that a code for condiments on a burger? Tomato, catsup, and pickle.

 

[PropSpin]

A lot of the responses in this thread show very little brain power being applied to consider the issue.
If you want to take this seriously, there are several points you need to think about a bit more.
1. There's a big assumption that DJI is somehow getting your photos and videos. - They aren't.
2. Who really thinks that anything they have photographed or shot video of is going to be of any strategic importance to anyone? Really?
Just look through a few hundred pix and videos here: Dronestagram | The #1 drone photography platform to get an idea how ridiculous the idea is.
3. Can you imagine being DJI's spymaster and going through al the millions of photos and videos looking for something of value? How much wasted time and effort would that take?
4. If China is really interested in seeing things in your area, they can send agents posing as tourists and visit the areas themselves.
They could fly their own drones, focusing on what they are really interested in or fly light aircraft to get good views.
Looking at a million random photos of things they have no interest in on the chance that someone has good imagery of something of strategic interest is laughable.
5. The vague DHS warning says that Chinese drones could steal valuable personal data. What valuable personal data does your drone have access to?
Why doesn't the DHS warn about Chinese made phones which have access to much more data than your drone does?

1. Says who?
2. Missing the point. It's not about any one person.
3. No. But I can imagine targeted efforts and AI.
4. DJI products and exposure are a potential piece of the intelligence puzzle.
5. Tell me, how does hacking work? Do you know everything that DJI assistant is doing, or DJI GO 4 on our personal devices? Gov't is warning about Huawei. Gov't also stopped sourcing networking hardware and software from China several years ago.

 

[PropSpin]

How much would you speculate the Chinese government influences, runs or interferes with most Chinese companies?

That's a good question, what do you think?
The June 3, June 10 issue of TIME has an article titled "The Battle for 5G" that highlights Huawei's role in the future of 5G. Here's a snippet from the article:
"Article VII of China's 2017 National Intelligence Law stipulates "any organization or citizen shall support, assist and cooperate with state intelligence work." Even were Huawei not complicit, there is little doubt that the Chinese government could impose its will. Every Chinese company is legally obliged to host internal CCP cells - where employees who are party officials meet to discuss ideology - whose allegiance and purpose is murky at best. "If the CCP tells Huawei to do something, then there's not going to be a lot of leeway to say no," says Adam Segal, director of the Digital and Cyberspace Policy Program at the Council on Foreign Relations.

Do American owned companies with Chinese facilities have a degree of autonomy?

My understanding is that American companies in China are forced to partner with Chinese companies and share (give up) intellectual property in order to gain access to the Chinese market. And they do it. I would expect the Chinese to exert as much control as they can get away with.

 

[Meta4]

1. Says who?
2. Missing the point. It's not about any one person.

1. Image and video files are very large.
If they were being transferred from your drone or tablet, you'd probably notice.
So far despite the hype and hysteria around this topic, I haven't heard anyone reporting any suspicious large data transfer.
Your photos and videos are stored on an SD card - not in the app.
You pull the SD card, copy to your computer and DJI never sees them again.
Even the extremely vague DHS warning didn't suggest that DJI siphons off your images and videos.
That's something the more imaginative users, primed with too much sci-fi and Hollywood but not enough critical thinking have come up with.

The warning from DHS’s Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA) only said that: the unmanned aircraft are a “potential risk to an organization’s information” and that the drones “contain components that can compromise your data and share your information on a server accessed beyond the company itself.
There's no hint there that your images are being scoured for strategic value.
And as I mentioned, the idea that drone flyer's images and video are going to provide a rich source of espionage material is simply ridiculous.

 

[MavicFT1P]

Samsung deepfake AI could fabricate a video of you from a single profile pic

Even the Mona Lisa can be faked.

www.cnet.com

You can buy sticker's on eBay to out over your phones cameras.
Expensive yah , but how much is Freedom worth?

 

[runeOfRune]

If you want to take this seriously(...)

I'm personally done educating the general public on technology. The response is "OMG UR A SHILL" or "I read this story on Facebleh and UR WORNG" anyway. Waste of breath. You spend 2 days reverse engineering something only to get hand-waved by the conspiracy crowd.

Their products were banned by the US Government for security risks.

And yet nobody has seen any proof of those "risks" existing. See, that's what I'm talking about, people blindly beleive things without even asking for proof, let alone verifying it.

The Chinese government and its corporations don't have the same divide ours do in the US.

Are you expecting anyone to believe this after earlier this month, US government ordered Google to drop Android support for future Huawei phones? Asking for a friend.

 

[MavicFT1P]

PLEASE let it be so!

Kyosho, Futaba, JR just to name a few.

Kyosho made the G-ZERO which was pretty cool.

Was basically a Drone that Hovered at a metre orso, and you used
a surface Tx to control it.
The point and shoot control system was interesting

There was even a FPV kit that went on your controller.
which you could then put on your RC car. Out of the box, if nothing else.

PS: Did Thunderdrones just give a thumbsup to China not being our friend ?

 

[Former Member]

Kyosho made the G-ZERO which was pretty cool.

Was basically a Drone that Hovered at a metre orso, and you used
a surface Tx to control it.
The point and shoot control system was interesting

There was even a FPV kit that went on your controller.
which you could then put on your RC car. Out of the box, if nothing else.

PS: Did Thunderdrones just give a thumbsup to China not being our friend ?
View attachment 73523View attachment 73523

Wow when was that introduced?

I like some Chinese products but I dont like the Chinese government. They are not an ally of the United States.