How to Exceed Max Altitude for Mountain Flying?

[DJ Kim]

See post above

The rep said the Max Flight Distance toggle switch controls both set max altitude and max radial distance.

Sorry, two different things.
Max Distance setting controls max radial distance.
even if you turn that off, the max altitude is still maxed out at 500m (1640ft).

if you set the max distance, less than 500m, then even with max altitude set at 500m, it would stop at whichever is shorter.

Tested.

 

[Cyberpower678]

Sorry, two different things.
Max Distance setting controls max radial distance.
even if you turn that off, the max altitude is still maxed out at 500m (1640ft).

if you set the max distance, less than 500m, then even with max altitude set at 500m, it would stop at whichever is shorter.

Tested.

Ok. Thanks. I tried.


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[AyeYo]

See post above

The rep said the Max Flight Distance toggle switch controls both set max altitude and max radial distance.

Mine is toggled off but I still can't set max altitude higher than 500m. Now whether I can FLY higher than 500m I don't know. The highest I've gone up a mountain was 1200ft vertical.

 

[cobra46]

Vehicle manufacures _do_ limit speed on vehicles for liability reasons. It's based on the tire rating. Just FYI, the Corvette does not have a limiter as it's tires are rated higher then the top speed of the vehicle.

It's about liability and over-sight.

Yes. I'm aware of this limit which is why I used a Vette in my example.

 

[DarkEnergy]

Seems some Chinese guys know the secret!!!

Not really. It is only 221.9m above departure level. According to these numbers the departure level is at 2200m-221.9m=1978.1m

 

[Cyberpower678]

Not really. It is only 221.9m above departure level. According to these numbers the departure level is at 2200m-221.9m=1978.1m

Wut?


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[AlanTheBeast]

I think you are confusing "above sea level" (ASL) with "above ground level" (AGL). I live at 7,800 ft (2,377 m) ASL and have no problem.

Looking at your picture I would guess that it was taken well above 1,640 feet unless you are in the Brooks Range of Alaska. It looks like Colorado?

It's relative to the start altitude. If you're at 2000' and have 5000' of mountain above you, you're borked.

 

[AlanTheBeast]

I live at the base of a very tall mountain. I like to use my Mavic to explore, but the 500m Max Altitude restriction is cramping my style. I know there are people crouched and ready to finger wag whenever someone talks about flying above 500m, but we all know that the actual FAA restriction is 400 ft above ground level. I've attached a frame grab that was taken at 500m and you can see that I'm definitely not anywhere close to 400 ft AGL. I'm wondering if I find a flat rock whether I could put down and reset the ground altitude. Not my first choice since a sudden gust could instantly create a Mavic-or-your-life mountain climbing decision. Any (worthwhile) suggestions?

I believe (from what I've read) that the workaround is to mask the GPS antenna with metal. Of course then you have to fly ATTI only and by line-of-sight and/or the camera view. Caveat Gubernator.

 

[tcope]

Yes. I'm aware of this limit which is why I used a Vette in my example.

I have to say, kudos for using a very good example.

I think the DJI limit is a good compromise. I'm sure the limit came from a sit down with the FAA (and other regulatory bodies) and it was a give aqnd take. Fewer actual legal restrictions in return for a very high altitude cap.

I won't discount people's want to fly "up mountains" however, I live near a lot of them and never seen this as a big issue. A drone camera is good at seeing what is under it. If I want to capture a mountain I can simply drive or hike up it and launch from above in order to shoot downward.

 

[tcope]

I believe (from what I've read) that the workaround is to mask the GPS antenna with metal. Of course then you have to fly ATTI only and by line-of-sight and/or the camera view. Caveat Gubernator.

Altitude is controlled by the barometer, not the GPS.

 

[WolfgangStiller]

If I want to capture a mountain I can simply drive or hike up it and launch from above in order to shoot downward.

Not so simple for many mountains. There are a number that take quite a long time and technical skill to summit and in my case, there are many that are beyond my skill level to reach anywhere near the summit.

I'd really like to see a feature where the Mavic could compare a loaded topo map with it's position and allow flight within the AGL limit. Even better would be a sensor that could read ground level but I don't think we'll see that any time soon.

 

[AlanTheBeast]

Altitude is controlled by the barometer, not the GPS.

Okay - but it seems I saw a video somewhere where the fellow masked the GPS (maybe to fly in forbidden airspace...). Can't find the video now.

So an "other hack" would be to rigidly block the vent to the baro sensor or somehow hack the f/w.

 

[tcope]

So an "other hack" would be to rigidly block the vent to the baro sensor or somehow hack the f/w.

I'll just leave it as I've mentioned before in this thread. It's currently not possible.

The done is simply not air tight (think about it... gimbal, motors, etc... all not air tight).

People have been talking about this same issue for years. Nothing here is new.

 

[tcope]

Not so simple for many mountains. There are a number that take quite a long time and technical skill to summit and in my case, there are many that are beyond my skill level to reach anywhere near the summit.

I'd really like to see a feature where the Mavic could compare a loaded topo map with it's position and allow flight within the AGL limit. Even better would be a sensor that could read ground level but I don't think we'll see that any time soon.

I thought I had deleted that last part of my message as I see a lot of people wanting to fly up a mountain. So I realize I'm one person and there are a lot that want to fly up. So I understand that.

I think what you mention will happen. It would be aimed at the drone maintaining it's altitude to avoid things like collisions and also to frame the camera shot correctly. I think it's simply a matter of time. There are a lot of other issues that go along with that as well. It's not just a matter of altitude above ground. If the software is going to adjust this on its own then it also needs to avoid objects above ground, such as buildings, trees, etc. DJI can't program their product to adjust it's height which results in it flying into a building. With waypoints they even went so far as to require a person to fly to the waypoint before setting (make sense now?). Granted, they have gotten a little away from this but they still require the user to set those locations.

 

[AlanTheBeast]

I'll just leave it as I've mentioned before in this thread. It's currently not possible.

The done is simply not air tight (think about it... gimbal, motors, etc... all not air tight).

I never said to "seal the aircraft" but the baro sensor itself.

See the hole on the sensor module. That is what would need a rigid (epoxy) blocker. (This is not the Mavic pro but is an example of such sensors).
http://www.robotshop.com/ca/en/bmp180-barometric-pressure-temperaturealtitude-sensor.html

Next of course ... how much is that baro altimeter coupled to the stabilty/controls of the MP ... ?
Is it "smoothed" with GPS/GLONASS/accelerometers ?

Sorry if this irritates you - but I feel for the OP and his frustration at wanting to climb that mountain - legally.

 

[maxfaxdude]

Hmmm, what about covering the baro sensor with a removable substance -- Would that work?

 

[tcope]

Next of course ... how much is that baro altimeter coupled to the stabilty/controls of the MP ... ?
Is it "smoothed" with GPS/GLONASS/accelerometers ?

I doubt its possible. If it were, it would require some major modification. I'm not talking about modification... only how it is now. Once we talk about the "possible modifications" we are getting into the unicorn region of "anything is possible".

Masking the barometer would create a lot of other issues. In the least, it would trigger issues with the software. If someone wants to heavily modify their Mavic and create other issues in order to fly up a mountain, I'd ask that they video the even and post here about what happened.

Sorry if this irritates you - but I feel for the OP and his frustration at wanting to climb that mountain - legally.

Sorry to give the impression that I'm irritated, I'm not. It's a thread that I chose to jump into and people have taken their own time to comment about. It's like me asking if the maximum height can be set to something more than 500m. How many ways can the answer be, no.

 

[AlanTheBeast]

Hmmm, what about covering the baro sensor with a removable substance -- Would that work?

It has to be quite rigid. Perhaps two layers of aluminum tape would do the job. You also have to locate the sensor. I don't see it on the teardowns.

 

[WolfgangStiller]

I thought I had deleted that last part of my message as I see a lot of people wanting to fly up a mountain. So I realize I'm one person and there are a lot that want to fly up. So I understand that.

I think what you mention will happen. It would be aimed at the drone maintaining it's altitude to avoid things like collisions and also to frame the camera shot correctly. I think it's simply a matter of time. There are a lot of other issues that go along with that as well. It's not just a matter of altitude above ground. If the software is going to adjust this on its own then it also needs to avoid objects above ground, such as buildings, trees, etc. DJI can't program their product to adjust it's height which results in it flying into a building. With waypoints they even went so far as to require a person to fly to the waypoint before setting (make sense now?). Granted, they have gotten a little away from this but they still require the user to set those locations.

Obstacle avoidance based on mapping data would be great but we're no where near that. Even using the best topo maps available, I have encountered unexpected rock out croppings and of course trees are not typically included on maps.

 

[cobra46]

It has to be quite rigid. Perhaps two layers of aluminum tape would do the job. You also have to locate the sensor. I don't see it on the teardowns.

I bet the hole is quite small and therefore whatever is used to trap the current pressure inside wouldn't have to be all that strong nor rigid.

A 1mm hole would only require 4 grams of force to hold back the pressure going from sea level all the way to 18,000 ft. So holding back pressure going from say 8,000 to 11,000 would be negligible.

I would like to see the results of someone trying this.

I'm not the drone police at all but don't forget we still have that pesky VLOS rule to deal with and I don't think you can see it traveling very far up a mountain side.