Drone Maker D.J.I. May Be Sending Data to China, U.S. Officials Say

[Thomas B]

That's the link from the OP ... not the link from post #6.

Ahhh gottit! Sorry... going too fast. Thx
Meant to reply to that article as originally posted by FLPilotshark.

 

[Meta4]

As far as Im concerned, DJI has no business knowing where I am, how much I fly, and any other personal information, without which they would disqualify me from flying as in a necessary app update. They work for me, and not the other way around.

DJI don't know any of that information unless you choose to share it with them by synching flight records.
DJI disqualify you from flying without data?
That sounds extremely unlikely.
There are many flyers that never synch their data and/or don't update but it doesn't restrict their ability to fly with the app.

I'd be much more concerned about the data your mobile phone is giving off every time you leave home.

 

[Lon Denard]

Good deal!
SF wanted us to use them forever per my agent. My wife elected not to do it also. Driving is wired in AZ. Posted streets at 45mph and traffic moves 55-60. Interested post 75 and at 85-90 mph I have people speeding by... just saying.
Glad yours makes it worthwhile.

Hey, I hear you. I don't own the cars I do or the sportbike I do because I like to drive slow. However, I put it on in the fall, drove with it all winter and by spring it was on its way back to Progressive. That was actually several years ago and I have been getting outstanding rates ever since. I literally got a call from State Farm a few months ago and they honestly quoted me that $1500 figure. AllState called recently with a similar number. I'd also double check that agent. No offense against State Farm but I had to go through 3 agencies before I found one that knew how to write a drone insurance policy. Just saying.

 

[Lon Denard]

DJI don't know any of that information unless you choose to share it with them by synching flight records.
DJI disqualify you from flying without data?
That sounds extremely unlikely.
There are many flyers that never synch their data and/or don't update but it doesn't restrict their ability to fly with the app.

I'd be much more concerned about the data your mobile phone is giving off every time you leave home.

Truth. Not to mention Home Assistants. I don't know if everyone knows this but you can go into your phone, open the maps app and it'll show you EVERYWHERE you've been, dates, times, etc. Absolutely everywhere.

 

[Thomas B]

Hey, I hear you. I don't own the cars I do or the sportbike I do because I like to drive slow. However, I put it on in the fall, drove with it all winter and by spring it was on its way back to Progressive. That was actually several years ago and I have been getting outstanding rates ever since. I literally got a call from State Farm a few months ago and they honestly quoted me that $1500 figure. AllState called recently with a similar number. I'd also double check that agent. No offense against State Farm but I had to go through 3 agencies before I found one that knew how to write a drone insurance policy. Just saying.

They must be getting tougher at SF... we have basically everything, with $500 deductible: two vehicles ( including my modded Taurus SHO.. 0-60 in 1.8sec) horse trailers, home etc and our 6 mo premium is just under $650. Of course I’ve been with the same agent and SF since 1986.

 

[Lon Denard]

They must be getting tougher at SF... we have basically everything, with $500 deductible: two vehicles ( including my modded Taurus SHO.. 0-60 in 1.8sec) horse trailers, home etc and our 6 mo premium is just under $650. Of course I’ve been with the same agent and SF since 1986.

Was that when you bought that Taurus? Hahaha! Sorry, Ford vs Dodge poke! Yea it has a lot to do with longevity and history with a company as well. I'm guessing my premium would be about $1100 without my discounts. Snap shot, safe driver, paid in full, etc.

 

[Thomas B]

Was that when you bought that Taurus? Hahaha! Sorry, Ford vs Dodge poke! Yea it has a lot to do with longevity and history with a company as well. I'm guessing my premium would be about $1100 without my discounts. Snap shot, safe driver, paid in full, etc.

NP. BTW. Got the SHO at about 375 crank HP... running it now at 625 wheel hp (dyno done)... tuner could have taken it to a bit over 700... but he advised that I’d shorten driveline life.

Meanwhile... back to drones

 

[Lon Denard]

NP. BTW. Got the SHO at about 375 crank HP... running it now at 625 wheel hp (dunk done)... tuner could have taken it to a bit over 700... but he advised that I’d shorten driveline life.

Meanwhile... back to drones

I daily drove mine so the red key rarely comes out. That's a lot of ponies out of that car, especially since they are quite light, if I remember correctly. Noice!

 

[FLPilotshark]

lol, Just putting it out there, I did not write the article!

 

[Former Member]

DJI don't know any of that information unless you choose to share it with them by synching flight records.
DJI disqualify you from flying without data?
That sounds extremely unlikely.
There are many flyers that never synch their data and/or don't update but it doesn't restrict their ability to fly with the app.

I'd be much more concerned about the data your mobile phone is giving off every time you leave home.

Wonder why the US Army was so upset if DJIs data mining was so benign... hmmm, maybe they were just paranoid, but I dont think so lol.

Im not as concerned about my cell phone, because I know thats what phones do and I expect and welcome it when it helps me. When the prime defenders of the USA have determined that software from a foreign concern have caused an alarm and data breach, thats where I get concerned. They know more than I do.

 

[sar104]

Wonder why the US Army was so upset if DJIs data mining was so benign... hmmm, maybe they were just paranoid, but I dont think so lol.

Im not as concerned about my cell phone, because I know thats what phones do and I expect and welcome it when it helps me. When the prime defenders of the USA have determined that software from a foreign concern have caused an alarm and data breach, thats where I get concerned. They know more than I do.

It was based on a classified US Army memo that made numerous assumptions. Which, in itself, doesn't meant that it wasn't happening, but the apps have been thoroughly tested since then to determine how much data was being transmitted and the current assessment is far more detailed. Thumbnails, flight tracks and other telemetry are transmitted if you choose to sync to the DJI servers. Who knows where those end up. If you don't choose to sync then the data transmitted are much more limited. If you use the Pilot app in local data mode then nothing leaves the device.

 

[Former Member]

It was based on a classified US Army memo that made numerous assumptions. Which, in itself, doesn't meant that it wasn't happening, but the apps have been thoroughly tested since then to determine how much data was being transmitted and the current assessment is far more detailed. Thumbnails, flight tracks and other telemetry are transmitted if you choose to sync to the DJI servers. Who knows where those end up. If you don't choose to sync then the data transmitted are much more limited. If you use the Pilot app in local data mode then nothing leaves the device.

If my memory serves me correctly, DJI decided to "back off" all its forced data collection and change the software after the Army identified the problem, ordered all instances of the software to be wiped clean from every Army device, and ordered all DJI devices to be grounded. Assumptions or not, I trust the US Army intelligence staff to detect these things, and for whatever reason, make itself more secure. Making itself secure trickles down to making me more secure.

Even though its products and software are used daily by hundreds of thousands of Americans, DJI is still a foreign owned entity. The USA is at odds with the Chinese globally, just think of their illegal air bases being constructed in the south China sea. And although we are in open trade with the Chinese, it does not mean that DJI did not try, in the Armys opinion, to go one step too far in their data collection. In doing what they did to the Army, they "messed with the wrong Marine."

New York Times:
China’s Sea Control Is a Done Deal, ‘Short of War With the U.S.’

Fox:
Pompeo: US worried over Chinese moves threatening navigation

 

[Maviac]

D.J.I. May Be Sending Data to China

Wrong, they might not be, THEY ARE and have been for a while. I trust the US Army to be my anti-malware informer.

My insurance company wanted me to install a device in my car so I could get an insurance discount. There were other reasons up their sleeve.

Unless you’re my grandmother who drives to church and to the grocery store once a week, please, please do not use one of these devices. I’ve represented many insurance companies over the years (and more recently represented people against them) and I can guarantee that nothing the insurers offer will ever help you.

Another piece of unsolicited advice, again gained from years of both representing and fighting insurance companies: generally speaking, the more commercials you see for an insurer, the worse they are. They have money for a marketing budget for a reason - they don’t pay claims. Examples: Progressive and GEICO - lots of commercials, terrible if you have a claim (or a claim against you). Amica - almost no commercials, but outstanding insurer.

 

[Former Member]

Unless you’re my grandmother who drives to church and to the grocery store once a week, please, please do not use one of these devices. I’ve represented many insurance companies over the years (and more recently represented people against them) and I can guarantee that nothing the insurers offer will ever help you.

Another piece of unsolicited advice, again gained from years of both representing and fighting insurance companies: generally speaking, the more commercials you see for an insurer, the worse they are. They have money for a marketing budget for a reason - they don’t pay claims. Examples: Progressive and GEICO - lots of commercials, terrible if you have a claim (or a claim against you). Amica - almost no commercials, but outstanding insurer.

Not sure I agree that Geico and Progressive dont pay claims, but surely agree about not installing the devices. It sounded too good to be true.

 

[Meta4]

If my memory serves me correctly, DJI decided to "back off" all its forced data collection and change the software after the Army identified the problem, ordered all instances of the software to be wiped clean from every Army device, and ordered all DJI devices to be grounded. Assumptions or not, I trust the US Army intelligence staff to detect these things, and for whatever reason, make itself more secure. Making itself secure trickles down to making me more secure.

There was a lot of misinformation and rumour getting around about the incident, particularly since the Army gave no explanation or details except to say it was a "cybersecurity concern".
There was no "forced data collection" for DJI to back off of but to satisfy those that couldn't believe that, DJI brought out an app that works without any connections to anywhere.

 

[Former Member]

There was a lot of misinformation and rumour getting around about the incident, particularly since the Army gave no explanation or details except to say it was a "cybersecurity concern".
There was no "forced data collection" for DJI to back off of but to satisfy those that couldn't believe that, DJI brought out an app that works without any connections to anywhere.

If the United States Army has determined that an app or software is acting suspiciously, thats good enough for me. DJI has the bad habit of doing something they shouldnt and asking for forgiveness instead of permission.

Another old, but relevant article:

Why the US Army DJI Ban is Probably Justified

 

[jagraphics]

You really could not make up this sort of paranoia.

Lots of threads from people inthe US shouting about China "Spying"
Equal or greater number of threads complaining about DJI NFZ being over zellous and you can't fly anywhere

Which is it?

It seems China is spying on open public areas with nothing sensitive in them where 95% of the video captured in the areas "spied" on is uploaded by the American pilots to the US systems Youtube Vimeo etc. This also includes some videos I have seen from flyers trying to see inside NFZ because they don't know what is in them (they are secret)

As mentioned if you want to spy on the USA Instagram Facebook, Youtube and Google Earth are the best sources. They al seem to be American Systems.

As for spying .... AT&T exchanges anyone.?

 

[jagraphics]

If the United States Army has determined that an app or software is acting suspiciously, thats good enough for me. DJI has the bad habit of doing something they should and asking for forgiveness instead of permission.

Another old, but relevant article:

Why the US Army DJI Ban is Probably Justified

You trust the US military? Snowden, Manning etc show you probalby can't both then nature of what they leaked and the fact that those two are the tip of (hopefully a very small) iceberg.

 

[BigAl07]

Ok gang... this one is getting WAY off topic. Let's reel it back in and get back to discussing the OP's link and stay on track.

 

[Former Member]

You trust the US military? Snowden, Manning etc show you probalby can't both then nature of what they leaked and the fact that those two are the tip of (hopefully a very small) iceberg.

Withdrawn

Yes I do. They are the ones who are gonna protect my rear end from the enemies of the United States, along with the UK, and all of Nato. This is just one good example, minor as it may be.

Snowden is an interesting, complicated story.