Mavic 3 Cine Losing Jobs

[Roamer105]

I owned an M2P from the start and while it had some growing pains initially, within less than 6 month the product was mature and working perfectly. Then the Air 2s was released last spring and I moved on. I do miss some of the more functional camera controls I had for the M2P but otherwise, the Air 2s is a perfect replacement and partial upgrade to the M2P.

The Air 2s was nearly perfect from the start last spring (most if not all issues then related to the FLY app). It shows that it is possible for DJI to release "finished" products and frankly they used to do much better. From a marketing perspective - well the A2S pretty much killed the remaining M2 market prior to M3 - that seemed a bit odd and maybe part of the reasons for the M3 debacle. This time around with the M3 they totally messed up in a number of ways: Releasing an unfinished product (their words I guess) at an outrageous price while marketing the new SC Pro in a contradictory ridiculous way by not offering it with the basic M3, offering it at an outrageous price as a separate unit and at the same time packaging it with the Air 2s flymore kit at a much lower price (less than half the price).

Now, 6 months in from initial release with several firmware updates they don't seem to be able to fix a very fundamental problem: GPS acquisition. NONE of the other DJI drones have any such issue. I don't know for sure but they either are using inferior GPS hardware which I start to believe is more and more credible since they can't seem to fix it or the company has lost its best engineers and management struggling their way to oblivion.

 

[Not A Speck Of Cereal]

Me: And I will continue to complain about it. Get over it.

In other words you will continue to be stressed out about it. Which in the long run not good for you health and well being over all. You have a decision to make here. The complaining is it really worth it? I bought the M3 knowing it wasn’t a finished product, DJI has released firmware to add features and make improvements, it’s certainly not complete yet, but the future updates to come looks promising. Also I haven’t seen one company yet to release a finished product. Apple, Samsung, LG, autel, Sony, the list goes on! They all release product and then work things out with software and firmware updates later. And it doesn’t look like this pattern or way of business is going to change anytime soon. So why complain and stressed yourself over it?

Um, no. I haven't bought the M3 and I have a nice M2P I can use. There's no stress here.

The complaining is absolutely worth while for me. DJI needs to hear it (though I know they probably don't monitor these forums). You do you — I'm tired of buying unfinished product that doesn't perform as advertised.

You haven't seen one company release finished product? Wow. I've seen many and have WORKED on many (I've been on many product teams). I own televisions and DVD players, cameras and lenses, home appliances, musical instruments, home medical devices, furniture and carpet, home improvement and woodworking tools, etc. that were all finished products when I bought them.

And I'll bet you have traveled in automobiles, busses, airplanes and trains that were quite possibly "feature complete" when they were sold.

It works like this (very basically):

• Conceive a product with a specification (end-result, features / functionalities / capabilities)
• Design the product to spec, including hardware manufacturing change and OS/software development
• When design and OS/software development is feature complete, Manufacture the product to spec.
• Release finished product. To spec. As designed.

That doesn't mean there aren't bugs that are fixed via firmware updates, or upgrades to capabilities via third party products (like filters for our drones). But on release, all of those things were complete with functionality as designed.

It's a shame you people are happy with DJI being half-assed in this regard, not just with grudging acceptance, but with full-on defense of this business model. It's weird that you're not complaining for better product releases, all of you. But hey, it's your money.

Chris

 

[Not A Speck Of Cereal]

[...] Now, 6 months in from initial release with several firmware updates they don't seem to be able to fix a very fundamental problem: GPS acquisition. NONE of the other DJI drones have any such issue. I don't know for sure but they either are using inferior GPS hardware which I start to believe is more and more credible since they can't seem to fix it or the company has lost its best engineers and management struggling their way to oblivion.

Right, it's not business as usual (this is what DJI's always done), it's gotten worse.

And it's not just the "feature compete" thing I've been mentioning. It's also clear that they released the product and that December firmware upgrade without sufficient testing.

Testing. Huh, what a concept.

Someone in this or another recent similar thread said that with DJI, they consider their user base to be the beta testers. The person that said that was defending DJI in this, because "this is the way they've always done it".

Weirdness.

Chris

 

[Point Zero]

Me: And I will continue to complain about it. Get over it.


Um, no. I haven't bought the M3 and I have a nice M2P I can use. There's no stress here.

The complaining is absolutely worth while for me. DJI needs to hear it (though I know they probably don't monitor these forums). You do you — I'm tired of buying unfinished product that doesn't perform as advertised.

You haven't seen one company release finished product? Wow. I've seen many and have WORKED on many (I've been on many product teams). I own televisions and DVD players, cameras and lenses, home appliances, musical instruments, home medical devices, furniture and carpet, home improvement and woodworking tools, etc. that were all finished products when I bought them.

And I'll bet you have traveled in automobiles, busses, airplanes and trains that were quite possibly "feature complete" when they were sold.

It works like this (very basically):

• Conceive a product with a specification (end-result, features / functionalities / capabilities)
• Design the product to spec, including hardware manufacturing change and OS/software development
• When design and OS/software development is feature complete, Manufacture the product to spec.
• Release finished product. To spec. As designed.

That doesn't mean there aren't bugs that are fixed via firmware updates, or upgrades to capabilities via third party products (like filters for our drones). But on release, all of those things were complete with functionality as designed.

It's a shame you people are happy with DJI being half-assed in this regard, not just with grudging acceptance, but with full-on defense of this business model. It's weird that you're not complaining for better product releases, all of you. But hey, it's your money.

Chris

That was a great post. I completely agree with all of your points, DJI really dropped the ball with the M3 in a bad way. I thought the Mavic 2 was in amazing shape just a few months after its release, nothing like any of the problems we have been seeing here on this Mavic 3 forum since October last year!

 

[lucizenfilm]

The mavic 3 does have LUT display assist though….

 

[VenomXts]

You can't expect a leopard to change his spots. DJI has been consistent with this method of product releases throughout. Surely, you must have known their history. Can't blame it on them, if you created unrealistic expectations for the M3 at release, assuming it was a finished product. In fact, DJI explicitly said it was unfinished!

i think we need to show them with returns. It is what I did, I love my air 2 loved my mini... returned my 3 but loved it as well... don't take **** we are the customer.

 

[UAVquadman]

I love Mavics. So small and with the Mavic 2 we have something same quality as an inspire with more stability. I had all of them. I just got the 3 Cine and now have retired it from any paid jobs for several reasons. The main one, as you might guess is inability to operate safely in DLog. They took away LUT assist. Operating in daylight with a screen displaying in LOG is virtually useless. We need to focus and expose and see safely and all of those are unsuitable in DLog. No professional will be monitoring a log colorspace. How absurd to even try. They also took away sharpening settings. I have noticed baked in NR on higher iso’s and over sharpening on lower ones. I also cannot operate the same with high speed motors as they took slow mode (tripod mode) away as well. The speeds are too fast for slow low creeps and sweeps and flying in heavy foliage. I tried modifying joysticks but honestly $5000 is embarrassing for what they put on the market. As a professional DP I just want to recommend toothers that the Mavic 2 is a much much better drone and will get you better more confident footage. The image is maybe 5% better on the 3 cine, in certain types of situations. Prores is pointless as the h265 grades and exposes and renders motion exactly the same. Ultra ultra low light is the only advantage withprores but in the noise you have all that muddy NR going on anyway so why bother. DJI is more focused on serving the chinese govt than DP pilots. 30 seconds and every pilot is like…”wheres the lut assist, wheres tripod mode in the switch…”. Newer is not better.

I got mine for $2000... no wonder you returned it.

 

[GadgetGuy]

...and there are plenty, that's what most threads are about, problems.

Indeed. I never knew about the original PhantomPilots forum until my P3P took an unwanted dive, and I went searching for online help! Happy owners don't require forum help.

 

[GadgetGuy]

And I will continue to complain about it. Get over it.

Chris

It's falling on deaf ears...

 

[GadgetGuy]

i think we need to show them with returns. It is what I did, I love my air 2 loved my mini... returned my 3 but loved it as well... don't take **** we are the customer.

They don't care. They'll just sell it to another more realistic customer. They aren't wanting for sales! According to independent 3rd parties, DJI still owns over 70% of the world wide drone market. Changing that to 69%, even if you successfully convinced 1% to return their purchases won't have any impact.

 

[christangey]

Tripod mode is on the list of features to be added in the next few months.

How do you know that? They also said HLG was coming back in the January update but nothing.

 

[christangey]

In other words you will continue to be stressed out about it. Which in the long run not good for you health and well being over all. You have a decision to make here. The complaining is it really worth it? I bought the M3 knowing it wasn’t a finished product, DJI has released firmware to add features and make improvements, it’s certainly not complete yet, but the future updates to come looks promising. Also I haven’t seen one company yet to release a finished product. Apple, Samsung, LG, autel, Sony, the list goes on! They all release product and then work things out with software and firmware updates later. And it doesn’t look like this pattern or way of business is going to change anytime soon. So why complain and stressed yourself over it?

He is not "complaining" he is demanding his rights as a consumer based on the financial outlay he has made on a product. You are comparing apples to oranges with the other manufacturers you mention above, none of them have ever released such an unfinished product as the M3. In fact under Australian consumer law the M3 would not be considered a 'merchantable item' i.e. "An item is deemed merchantable if it is fit for the ordinary purposes for which such products are manufactured and sold."

 

[GadgetGuy]

He is not "complaining" he is demanding his rights as a consumer based on the financial outlay he has made on a product. You are comparing apples to oranges with the other manufacturers you mention above, none of them have ever released such an unfinished product as the M3. In fact under Australian consumer law the M3 would not be considered a 'merchantable item' i.e. "An item is deemed merchantable if it is fit for the ordinary purposes for which such products are manufactured and sold."

I beg to differ. He is complaining. Apparently, you have never bought anything from Autel Robotics! They make DJI look like a choir boy! On what basis are you contending that the Mavic 3 isn't fit for the ordinary purposes for which such products are manufactured and sold? It's sold as a 4/3 camera with a 1/2” 7x telephoto camera mounted onto a drone with up to a 5 mile range. Not liking the DLog sounds more like pixel peeping and an extraordinary use with standards that exceed the ordinary purposes. Besides, everything is still being tweaked, and improved based upon feedback. If your standards are based upon Australian consumer law, take it up with the Australian authorities, and see if they agree with your bizarre interpretation. M3 was openly announced as being unfinished by DJI upon release. It's called assumption of the risk when you buy it unfinished.

 

[christangey]

I beg to differ. He is complaining. Apparently, you have never bought anything from Autel Robotics! They make DJI look like a choir boy! On what basis are you contending that the Mavic 3 isn't fit for the ordinary purposes for which such products are manufactures and sold? It's sold as a 4/3 camera with a 1/2” 7x telephoto camera mounted onto a drone with up to a 5 mile range. Not liking the DLog sounds more like pixel peeping and an extraordinary use with standards that exceed the ordinary purposes. Besides, everything is still being tweaked, and improved based upon feedback. If your standards are based upon Australian consumer law, take it up with the Australian authorities, and see if they agree with your bizarre interpretation. M3 was openly announced as being unfinished by DJI upon release. It's called assumption of the risk when you buy it unfinished.

Trouble is gadget, you live in a country that has some of the most pathetic consumer laws in the world, probably on par with China, so that's the standard you are basing you your view on. "Ordinary" purposes are based on a $5000 drone not a toy.

 

[RawRock]

I knew this would happen when I heard the MP3 was coming out. Then I seen the controller looked like they went back to a old version of controller from back before Mavic. I figured their would be bugs for a year or two, like the MP2 did. It was a couple yrs before I bought one because of all the bugs I was waiting for them to work out. If I get another dji product it will probably be the FPV drone with the goggles. I think when I had the Mavic Platinum with the goggles it was the best part. Then I got a Mavic Pro 2 waiting for the ocusync 2.0 goggles to come and they never did. But I just feel like the MP3 is gonna not live up to the past Mavic versions…. Maybe DJI is so big now and doing so many different things they stopped focusing so much on their better drones. I feel like all their attention now is on the smaller dji drones. But to pay almost double what I paid for my Mavic Pro 2 and then to realize it wasn’t twice the product; I would feel cheated.. I feel bad for those that spent that much money on a drone and then realize its not the product that a drone 3 yrs ago was that was half the price. Maybe not half but still its alot of money which makes you think of major upgrades and performance. People that ask me all the time about drones I always recommend them finding a Mavic Pro 2 right now…. I hope they never phase out batteries like they did for other drones. That scares me thinking one day I probably will have to upgrade because I will have batteries go out and finally won’t be able to find any.. Hopefully by then they will have alot of the bugs worked out…. Lol

 

[GadgetGuy]

Trouble is gadget, you live in a country that has some of the most pathetic consumer laws in the world, probably on par with China, so that's the standard you are basing you your view on. "Ordinary" purposes are based on a $5000 drone not a toy.

All due respect, but my realistic expectations are based upon 6 years of prior experience with DJI, and not reliance upon any consumer protection laws. I'm a realist, not an idealist. I live in the real world, and not in a utopia. Unless you are an Australian consumer protection attorney, your layman's interpretation of even your own country's consumer protection laws are interesting, but unfortunately not of any legal value. Sue DJI and let us know how it works out for you.

 

[GadgetGuy]

I knew this would happen when I heard the MP3 was coming out. Then I seen the controller looked like they went back to a old version of controller from back before Mavic. I figured their would be bugs for a year or two, like the MP2 did. It was a couple yrs before I bought one because of all the bugs I was waiting for them to work out. If I get another dji product it will probably be the FPV drone with the goggles. I think when I had the Mavic Platinum with the goggles it was the best part. Then I got a Mavic Pro 2 waiting for the ocusync 2.0 goggles to come and they never did. But I just feel like the MP3 is gonna not live up to the past Mavic versions…. Maybe DJI is so big now and doing so many different things they stopped focusing so much on their better drones. I feel like all their attention now is on the smaller dji drones. But to pay almost double what I paid for my Mavic Pro 2 and then to realize it wasn’t twice the product; I would feel cheated.. I feel bad for those that spent that much money on a drone and then realize its not the product that a drone 3 yrs ago was that was half the price. Maybe not half but still its alot of money which makes you think of major upgrades and performance. People that ask me all the time about drones I always recommend them finding a Mavic Pro 2 right now…. I hope they never phase out batteries like they did for other drones. That scares me thinking one day I probably will have to upgrade because I will have batteries go out and finally won’t be able to find any.. Hopefully by then they will have alot of the bugs worked out…. Lol

I have three M2P's and three P4P's and I still prefer the Mavic 3 over them for everything. The 4/3 sensor and the 7x telephoto, with a realistic 33 minute flight time, and HiRes 60Mb 360° panos now cover all of my needs better than the 4 year old M2P's and even older P4P's. I bought the regular M3, hub, 3 extra batteries, and RC-Pro all a la carte, because I didn't want a $350 backpack, and don't want to risk losing an unremovable SSD every time I fly. Whether the Cine version is worth the money is a business decision. I can buy two M3's for the price of one Cine version, and the M3 is only marginally more expensive than the M2P. The RC-Pro investment is leveraged with the Air 2S compatibility. M3 and M3 Cine will only get better with time. The happy sweet spot for any new DJI drone is 6-12 months after release. Takes that long to get all the bugs out, and optimize the FW and app, and add any promised features not available at release.

 

[Point Zero]

I have three M2P's and three P4P's and I still prefer the Mavic 3 over them for everything. The 4/3 sensor and the 7x telephoto, with a realistic 33 minute flight time, and HiRes 60Mb 360° panos now cover all of my needs better than the 4 year old M2P's and even older P4P's. I bought the regular M3, hub, 3 extra batteries, and RC-Pro all a la carte, because I didn't want a $350 backpack, and don't want to risk losing an unremovable SSD every time I fly. Whether the Cine version is worth the money is a business decision. I can buy two M3's for the price of one Cine version, and the M3 is only marginally more expensive than the M2P. The RC-Pro investment is leveraged with the Air 2S compatibility. M3 and M3 Cine will only get better with time. The happy sweet spot for any new DJI drone is 6-12 months after release. Takes that long to get all the bugs out, and optimize the FW and app, and add any promised features not available at release.

Send me one of your M2P's dude, I will be the best surrogate father ever, I promise

 

[GadgetGuy]

Send me one of your M2P's dude, I will be the best surrogate father ever, I promise

The formal adoption process can be a bit pricey.

 

[EsaT]

Now they r supposedly coming out with mini 3 but at significant price increase.

I hope they get some good competition soon. ....and Autel is going down the same path

Actually it was exactly Autel who pushed sub 250 gram mini drones into new price level...

PS: It's too bad Autel is sitting on their hands--they have an excellent opportunity to grab market share here with better "feature complete" releases.

It looks like Autel isn't even interested on competing against DJI with hardly any resellers in Europe.
And don't know about that "feature complete" thing when they clearly didn't even have any drones to sell untill many months after the release.